Enlightenment Genetics

[Phil]

10 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

Perhaps and perhaps not.  

In accordance with direct experience it’s a belief. 

[Robed Mystic]

Just now, Orb said:

Yes. Some are believed some are let go. 

Well, my recommendation would be to et them ALL go.  They are all illusory.   The longer you sit and let ALL of them go, something may - well, for lack of a better word   happen- in which you will become the present moment itself and then pass out of the Matrix.  This is simply a shift in consciousness brought on by a complete lack of thought.  The problem now is your are entertaining some thoughts over others.  Like for example - one guru over another, maybe ? 🙂

 

[Jonas Long]

16 minutes ago, Mandy said:

Believing thoughts of identification, which is duality, one will be like a pendulum going back and forth from deep insecurity to unexamined pride. Not pride as in self love, but pride as in total exclusion. You could have the same kind of pride in being someone who isn't racist or sexist. Exclusion never ever wins or comes up above. There's no excuse, no good reason for it. I am no better than a white supremacist, both of us are not. 

Not better, but more aware, I'd say I'm certainly more aware than a nazi.  Sure there's the very tempting trap of being proud of having more awareness, but it does seem to be a "preferable" trap to the former.  Still, its one to rise above, but first youd have to rise above the trap of being ignorant.  Idk, is there truly no Heirarchy to awareness?  I really don't know. 

[Mandy]

17 minutes ago, DMT Elf said:

Intelligence is definitely enlightenment.

It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven. 

 

Jesus wasn't talking about money. 

[Robed Mystic]

6 minutes ago, Phil said:

In accordance with direct experience it’s a belief. 

Eloquent if only it were true.  If everyone could just sit down and get in touch with direct experience would they awaken?   If that was true we would have a very different society. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Robed Mystic

[Mandy]

7 minutes ago, Jonas Long said:

Not better, but more aware, I'd say I'm certainly more aware than a nazi.  Sure there's the very tempting trap of being proud of having more awareness, but it does seem to be a "preferable" trap to the former.  Still, its one to rise above, but first youd have to rise above the trap of being ignorant.  Idk, is there truly no Heirarchy to awareness?  I really don't know. 

The hierarchy only helps to let go of judgement and love those MF'ers anyway. That love also happens to be transformational and the ONLY transformation that is also steady and unwavering. Other than a tool for understanding/letting go of judgement, there's no hierarchy in the actual love, which is where it was pointing to anyway. Hierarchy is only pointing. The only thing beyond the pointing itself, but what is pointed to is also prior to it. 

[Jonas Long]

Just now, DMT Elf said:

Don't just write down a different word though. Explain in detail exactly what enlightenment is.

Liberation from what is false and causes suffering. 

[Jonas Long]

11 minutes ago, Mandy said:

The hierarchy only helps to let go of judgement and love those MF'ers anyway. That love also happens to be transformational and the ONLY transformation that is also steady and unwavering. Other than a tool for understanding/letting go of judgement, there's no hierarchy in the actual love, which is where it was pointing to anyway. Hierarchy is only pointing. The only thing beyond the pointing itself, but what is pointed to is also prior to it. 

To graduate from being a nazi to being proud of not being one, I have to say feels like a "step up"...to me at least.  I guess the ultimate step up is to get to where you are talking about and love them as much as yourself....not there yet personally. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Jonas Long

[Orb]

19 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

Well, my recommendation would be to et them ALL go.  They are all illusory.   The longer you sit and let ALL of them go, something may - well, for lack of a better word   happen- in which you will become the present moment itself and then pass out of the Matrix.  This is simply a shift in consciousness brought on by a complete lack of thought.  The problem now is your are entertaining some thoughts over others.  Like for example - one guru over another, maybe ? 🙂

 

The original point you made is that the matrix is indeed real and that you can get out of it. 

 

I brought up that that is just a thought and that you already aren't in a matrix. 

 

When I asked about if there would be a matrix if thought didn't arise, I wasn't implying that thoughts don't arise at all in my experience, I'm pointing to the fact that Matrix is only a thought, and if it didn't arise then what do you think would remain? 

 

Now you're doing that thing where you start to frame yourself as a superior/someone who knows more, basically saying "when you get to my level you'll really awaken". Which is fooling no one. In fact it only gets worse and more obvious every time you do it. 

 

So instead of inquiring into the question "if there were no thought, would there be a matrix", you deflect with a personal remark like "you don't really get it, you're not at my level" in order to wiggle out of not having to inquire. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Orb

[Orb]

18 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

Like for example - one guru over another, maybe ? 🙂

 

This is for you, idk why you're telling me this 😂

[Phil]

18 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

Eloquent if only it were true. 

Don’t believe or trust me or what’s being said. Check direct experience and see that it is a belief. 

 

18 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

If everyone could just sit down and get in touch with direct experience would they awaken?

This is why I offered a hundred bucks for three months away from the kool aid. When you drink what you’re peddling it inevitably dawns on you that you’re only deceiving yourself. 

 

That selves, people, humans or the like awaken or have understanding, or levels or degree of wakefulness (awareness, consciousness) is a complete misunderstanding. It’s the materialist’s paradigm purported as I’m awake, also referred to as solipsism. 

 

18 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

   If that was true we would have a very different society. 

Without purporting & deceiving, we will. 

[Mandy]

4 minutes ago, Jonas Long said:

To graduate from being a nazi to being proud of not being one, I have to say feels like a "step up"...to me at least.  I guess the ultimate step up is to get to where you are talking about and love them as much as yourself....not there yet personally. 

There's not a where, or a you that can get there in the future, just do it now. There's no reason to try to love the thing that's the hardest to love, that's just an excuse to not love now.  It doesn't matter what you choose to focus on. Focus on something easy to love, love is known by how it feels, it feels like love. No separation of lover and loved. Instead of steps up, there's thoughts that increase resistance (feel worse to focus on) or thoughts that decrease resistance (feel better). It really gets no bigger and grander than right now. 

[Jonas Long]

7 minutes ago, Mandy said:

There's not a where, or a you that can get there in the future, just do it now. There's no reason to try to love the thing that's the hardest to love, that's just an excuse to not love now.  It doesn't matter what you choose to focus on. Focus on something easy to love, love is known by how it feels, it feels like love. No separation of lover and loved. Instead of steps up, there's thoughts that increase resistance (feel worse to focus on) or thoughts that decrease resistance (feel better). It really gets no bigger and grander than right now. 

I understand, but, like Maslows Heirarchy of needs, there has to be some sort of strengthening your ability to love through gradually increasing your resistance to falling back into the being bothered by everything you don't like.  Maybe, idk. Maybe not. 

[Jonas Long]

4 minutes ago, DMT Elf said:

Knowledge isn't necessarily intelligence.

Knowledge is what caused the fall from paradise.  To return there has to be a stripping down of all that knowledge. 

[Robed Mystic]

17 minutes ago, Orb said:

 

The original point you made is that the matrix is indeed real and that you can get out of it. 

 

I brought up that that is just a thought and that you already aren't in a matrix. 

 

When I asked about if there would be a matrix if thought didn't arise, I wasn't implying that thoughts don't arise at all in my experience, I'm pointing to the fact that Matrix is only a thought, and if it didn't arise then what do you think would remain? 

 

 

I get what you are saying and I'm telling you this is a trap.   Your thought that this is a matrix is indeed a thought and it is not real.  But what is true or "real" as you say, is that there is a different state of consciousness in which you can step out of the matrix and realize yourself as God.  That is my claim, anyway.  Make of it as you wish 

[Phil]

7 minutes ago, DMT Elf said:

Knowledge isn't necessarily intelligence.

Intelligence isn’t even intelligence. 

[Mandy]

3 minutes ago, DMT Elf said:

Knowledge isn't necessarily intelligence.

Intelligence would be the very capacity to gain knowledge then right? So if intelligence is the measurement of size of the storage unit, and the knowledge is the stuff in it, what one really IS (Awakening) would be realizing that one is the infinite space itself, and that the storage unit size still doesn't come into play. The act of measuring IS the limitation, the belief in limitations IS the limitation. If one believes that they have the biggest storage unit, it's like a camel going through the eye of the needle to realize that one is infinite in neither direction of big or small. 

[Robed Mystic]

16 minutes ago, Phil said:

Don’t believe or trust me or what’s being said. Check direct experience and see that it is a belief. 

 

This is why I offered a hundred bucks for three months away from the kool aid. When you drink what you’re peddling it inevitably dawns on you that you’re only deceiving yourself. 

 

That selves, people, humans or the like awaken or have understanding, or levels or degree of wakefulness (awareness, consciousness) is a complete misunderstanding. It’s the materialist’s paradigm purported as I’m awake, also referred to as solipsism. 

 

Without purporting & deceiving, we will. 

Lol.  That's a real perverted form of the materialist paradigm then.  I think you greatly misunderstand what the materialist paradigm is.   That there can be different states of consciousness is not objectivity by any means.  

[Mandy]

9 minutes ago, Jonas Long said:

I understand, but, like Maslows Heirarchy of needs, there has to be some sort of strengthening your ability to love through gradually increasing your resistance to falling back into the being bothered by everything you don't like.  Maybe, idk. Maybe not. 

You don't have an ability to love, it's not like a muscle you strengthen, it's what you're not thinking to cloud it. Maslow's hierarchy and any hierarchy or map is a tool that can be used to clarify or to cloud, like any other tool. You know by how it feels in the moment. 

[Jonas Long]

7 minutes ago, Robed Mystic said:

Lol.  That's a real perverted form of the materialist paradigm then.  I think you greatly misunderstand what the materialist paradigm is.   That there can be different states of consciousness is not objectivity by any means.  

Is being awake a different state of consciousness to being asleep?  Getting stoned or caffeinated or horny or in love are different states of consciousness.  That fits within the materialist paradigm.