Jonas Long Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 1 minute ago, Devin said: @Lester Retsel You hate that people get fooled by false teachers I don't "hate" that either, that's also your reading of it. I just see it as unfortunate and not necessarily, so I feel compelled to speak about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 Just now, Devin said: Okay well whatever words you wanna use, you're indirectly promoting the net effect of people being fooled by false teachers In what way exactly do you think I am doing that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Devin said: Ok, that's what you say I'm doing, but I explained very clearly how that isn't the case. Responsibility always goes both ways, but begins with the teacher. You are responsible for the teachings you consume.. the teacher is responsible for what they teach AND what people do under their influence, to a degree. Both. I have to insist on being through with this conversation. Voya con Dios or whatever Edited September 19, 2022 by Lester Retsel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 8 minutes ago, Devin said: And you would say you're doing that out of love wouldn't you? Sorry, immutable universal law of society, or in layman's terms we call it " bringing it back full circle" You're doing something out of love but you're harming them instead, pedophiles think the same way I don't believe I am doing harm, but, if I'm wrong, I will be held responsible for it, I'm willing to risk being wrong and taking whatever responsibility comes of it, but I do not agree with your assessment. Now. Good day sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 1 minute ago, Devin said: I know you don't, I think you're doing it sincerely in good faith with good intentions Same as Leo does Same as many pedophiles do Sleep tight We will all be held responsible for whatever it is we do. Don't let the bedbugs BITE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 1 minute ago, Devin said: I thought Jesus died for that!? Allegory. Jesus is all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 10 minutes ago, Devin said: I thought Jesus died for that!? Guess we should do nothing? There you go teaching that bad stuff again Good lord...I'd LOVE to see what would happen if you tried to hold Leo's feet to the fire the way you're doing with me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 @Lester Retsel I'm back. I will say, I think you give too much attention to leo and you kinda give him more clout by talking about him so much. I know it comes from a good place and I agree that leo isn't the best teacher, but I think it's time to let him go. I mean, do you feel good putting so much focus on him? How'd it feel if you lived your life from now on with no more thoughts about Leo? Sometimes we can get too hung up on someone and start to blame all our emotions on that one person. There's a time to criticize/gossip and there's a time to let it go. Let the flames dim. ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 1 minute ago, Orb said: @Lester Retsel I'm back. I will say, I think you give too much attention to leo and you kinda give him more clout by talking about him so much. I know it comes from a good place and I agree that leo isn't the best teacher, but I think it's time to let him go. I mean, do you feel good putting so much focus on him? How'd it feel if you lived your life from now on with no more thoughts about Leo? Sometimes we can get too hung up on someone and start to blame all our emotions on that one person. There's a time to criticize/gossip and there's a time to let it go. Let the flames dim. I absolutely agree. I'm not going to make any more videos on him, and this thread will be last I speak about him. My hope is eventually he'll be gone and I can remove the videos I've done about him. Yeah I've given him too much already, it's a flaw of mine that I've held on to it too long, I struggle with that for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 @Lester Retsel really appreciate your honesty 🙏. ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) @DMT Elf i got into the act.org world back when his latest videos were on spiral dynamics. This was during 2018. He had upgraded from the level 1 black shirt to the level 2 black button up shirt. He had some interesting stuff that was more based on psychology than spirituality although he spoke about enlightenment too. then about a year later he came back from a 5meo dmt trip and started wearing a white shirt, this was the beginning of the downfall imo. His videos immediately began to go down the solipsism route and he got more and more invested into spirituality. I've seen a few phases of the forum. There's always a handful of guys who parrot everything he says and act enlightened and repeat the latest things Leo's said, then they get bored, disappear, and are replaced by a new group of people who do the same thing. Then a small number of people also throughout the years that actually wake up, and they begin seeing the gap between what leo says and the direct truth they themselves realize. I was a forum member when @James123 self realized and made a thread about it, I was one of the people who didnt believe him lol. He was eventually banned if I'm not mistaken. Edited September 20, 2022 by Orb ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) @DMT Elf yea in my experience. It always happens eventually, at first he starts saying that you're misleading people, then he'll say something like "watch it, you're taking things too far" something along those lines, then he'll ban you. The way he removed Phil from the forum was genius. What he did was he convinced everyone that Phil was out of touch with reality, basically made him out to be crazy, then he made a whole narrative around how he just had to demote Phil because he wasn't "teaching at the level of where the students were at". The mind is always thirsty for complexity in order to strengthen its own knowledge, so in spiritual matters complex answers are seen as helpful, while simple straight forward answers are seen as "out of touch" or too vague, or unhelpful. Basically the mind gets upset with answers that Phil (or any other straight forward spiritual friend) gives because it stops the food supply for the separate self. Then the separate self is like "man your answers are too vague! You need to teach at my level, you're stage turquoise I'm only orange/green! Teach at my level" basically the ego saying "gimme some food man please! I don't really care about an answer, I want to strengthen my knowledge more because I am knowledge!". Kinda like giving a homeless guy a penny. Okay that was fucked up I know Went off on a whole tangent but it felt good to clarify things. Edited September 20, 2022 by Orb ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) @DMT Elf fundamentally leo is attached to states, but the truth is beyond states according to buddhist sutras /advaita. so leo takes a psychedelic, then he believes that the psychedelic state is somehow more true than any other state, but...it's just another state. A state no matter how profound it is....is a state. Our aim so to speak is to transcend, so if you're caught up on a particular state, that is something to transcend imo. Imagine how ridiculous I would sound if I said that coffee makes me enlightened because it puts me in a heightened state of wakefulness, that somehow the coffee experience is more true than other experiences. So keeping this in mind, Leo views all of spirituality from the lens of "states of consciousness". So when leo hears about concepts like "emptiness" from Buddhism he literally thinks these people are in a state of consciousness where it's like a black empty void lol, but this is NOT at all what the word "emptiness" points to. So he has this intense 5meo dmt experience, then he compares it with this black void experience he made up in his head and believes is what "nothingness/emptiness" points to, and then chooses the 5meo dmt state and says it's better, then veils it with the label "God-Realization" to cover it all up. He needs to make money in the spiritual market place, so he made up the label God-Realization and he doesn't like buddhism/advaita because it wouldn't be good for business. I'm not sure if it's being done intentionally, but it's being done. Edited September 20, 2022 by Orb ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 16 minutes ago, DMT Elf said: @Orb What does emptiness point to? Is it the same as no-self? Or is it more about how no concepts, belief, etc. can ever encapsulate reality? To me, pure potential, the fool(0) of the tarot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Long Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) 28 minutes ago, DMT Elf said: Like unlimited possible outcomes resulting from no "fixed" outcome? Well I would say resulting from no fixed outcome because it's not the "result" of anything.. There is a force which precedes all action. The emptiness precedes that force. Edited September 20, 2022 by Lester Retsel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 @Orb @DMT Elf https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/78359-reason-of-i-was-banned-and-nahm-removed-from-mod/#comment-1092559 Just read this guys 😂😂😂 "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 4 minutes ago, DMT Elf said: @James123 Why did you get banned from actualized? Talking too much shit? Because of this 😂😂😂https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/58508-leo’s-beautiful-endless-wonderland/#comment-789923 "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 @Devin Exploitation is not always material. Sometimes these things are due to believing some shitty thoughts and feeling insecure or unworthy. And then one might use all sorts of platforms to appear as strong, better, more worthy. There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orb Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 6 hours ago, DMT Elf said: @Orb What does emptiness point to? Is it the same as no-self? Or is it more about how no concepts, belief, etc. can ever encapsulate reality? @DMT Elf it's all about no-self imo. For most of us it seems like there must be a gap in direct experience, some kind of "space" for a separate self to inhabit. But there isn't actually a space at all, there's no gap. This is what emptiness points to imo, I think it gets even deeper than that. Of course this is way more profound than it sounds in direct experience. ♾️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 7 hours ago, DMT Elf said: @Orb What does emptiness point to? Is it the same as no-self? Or is it more about how no concepts, belief, etc. can ever encapsulate reality? You can only be empty, when you not know, as before so called birth. And that's enlightenment. "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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