Kundalini 6 months later

[spiritual dreams]

About 6 months ago I awakened kundalini. I can only describe it as an intense energy that moves up the body which amplifies conscousness, awareness, emotions and thought patterns. Daniel Ingram calls it the arising and passing away, Phil I think called it the dissolving of conditioning, it doesn't really matter, just conceptual labels.

 

Since then it has fucked me up beyond recognition.  After the initial bliss states faded away I can only describe it as a bad trip that does not end. It has taken me to hellish places that I would not wish on anybody and stripped away everything I held dear. All my beliefs, values and ways of looking at reality have been stripped away and revealed to be mental fabrications and wishful thinking. My underlying mental issues have been amplified to the point where it has taken over my whole life. I experience intense anxiety, despair, anger, unease, OCD, extreme worrying, dissociation and pretty much everything else on a daily basis. I have had to quit my job and move back in with my parents.

 

Before kundalini I believed in love, god, infinite consciousness, oneness etc... Now I realise those were all bullshit conceptualizations and fabrications I deluded myself into believing. I have also become aware of just how much suffering there was in me and how much suffering there is in the world. I cannot see the world as a good place. My worldview has dissolved so I don't know anything anymore. Is materialism true, idealism? buddhism? Leo's solipsism? phil's creator stuff? God? These are just mental fabrications. I don't know anything but my direct experience and I'm not even sure of that anymore. Even my sense of self and identity was also a fabrication.

 

At the same time... I don't want to go back. Now that i have realised how deluded I was, I simply can't go back. I wasn't exactly having a good time before this either. My attatchment to my personal identity and story have decreased so I no longer care about petty ego shit as much which is incredibly freeing. Going back would be like going back into the matrix.

 

I don't know how much longer this is going to last or whats going to happen to me but hey, it is what it is...

Edited March 9 by spiritual dreams

[Phil]

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

I don't know anything anymore

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

My underlying mental issues have been amplified to the point where it has taken over my whole life. I experience intense anxiety, despair, anger, unease, OCD, extreme worrying, dissociation

 

A lot still seems to be known. That is intense emotional suppression. As emotions are acknowledged relief is felt and suffering diminishes inevitably entirely dispelled.

 

Self referential thoughts are the ‘beliefs loops’, and are the emotional suppression. 

 

“It is what it is” is an apathetic attitude 

 

[spiritual dreams]

1 hour ago, Phil said:

A lot still seems to be known. That is intense emotional suppression. As emotions are acknowledged relief is felt and suffering diminishes inevitably entirely dispelled.

 

yes, a lot of emotions are being suppressed. There is a weird mechanism where intense fear solidifies into extremely painful energetic symptoms in my body. Trying to feel into the intense negative emotions works sometimes but other times it makes the energy cramp up even more. Sometimes when I acnkowledge emotions, the emotions turn into energy which moves up the body and causes energy to cramp up and contract in other areas.

 

1 hour ago, Phil said:

Self referential thoughts are the ‘beliefs loops’, and are the emotional suppression. 

Yes, thoughts of a seperate self that suffers are often believed. Its hard to detect when emotions are overwhelming. There is also an intense dissociation and brain fog that seems to cloud awareness most of the time making it difficult to disidentify from these thoughts.

1 hour ago, Phil said:

“It is what it is” is an apathetic attitude 

yep. I kinda gave up after being overwhelmed for so long.

[Mandy]

Stop conceptualizing it as kundalini. Just do your basic routine, meditation first thing in the morning, and then later in the afternoon, exercise, eat really healthy, flow of consciousness journal, do something creative. You'll be back at the top of your game in no time. If stuff comes up, let it go, don't conceptualize it as a kundalini or some stage of awakening.  This is just life. Pure, magic bliss, love. IT IS WHAT IT IS. 

[Phil]

@spiritual dreams

Overwhelment’s an emotion (for the win). No judgement of the guidance (negative emotions) for The Big Win. 

Disidentifying!?!?

[Phil]

@spiritual dreams

Do you have a dreamboard going? 
Is there a point to this madness? 
 

[WhiteOwl]

14 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

Trying to feel into the intense negative emotions works sometimes but other times it makes the energy cramp up even more. Sometimes when I acnkowledge emotions, the emotions turn into energy which moves up the body and causes energy to cramp up and contract in other areas.

When the energy cramps up, that is when you know you are doing the right thing. Keep focus on the feeling and relax as much as possible and breath from the stomach. It will have a "peak" and then start to fade away and you will see what magic was underneath it all the time. 

Follow the emotion/energy moving around and don't stop when it contracts, if possible.

 

If you start to do this as a practice, you will start to feel excited when you meet stuck energy / emotion since you will quickly find out how much love is waiting for you underneath. 

Edited March 10 by WhiteOwl

[Phil]

15 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

yes, a lot of emotions are being suppressed. There is a weird mechanism where intense fear solidifies into extremely painful energetic symptoms in my body.

Energy is love. 

 

15 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

Trying to feel into the intense negative emotions works sometimes but other times it makes the energy cramp up even more.

Energy is love. 

 

15 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

Sometimes when I acnkowledge emotions, the emotions turn into energy which moves up the body and causes energy to cramp up and contract in other areas.

Energy is love. 

 

15 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

 

Yes, thoughts of a seperate self that suffers are often believed. It’s hard to detect when emotions are overwhelming. There is also an intense dissociation and brain fog that seems to cloud awareness most of the time making it difficult to disidentify from these thoughts.

Overwhelment is an emotion. 

 

Dissociation, disidentifying from thoughts, spiritual bypassing, and conceptualizing emotions is not recommended. That is the opposite of receiving the guidance and allowing interpretations to change (alignment of thoughts with feeling). 

 

 

Insecurity/Guilt/Unworthiness:

Bypassing disparaging self referential thoughts with the expression of insecurity, guilt and or unworthiness relieves the body-mind of unnecessary tension & dissonance, and is self-love as it’s an allowing of self-inherent self-awareness, self-compassion, self-worth and empowerment to be unfettered and arise.

[spiritual dreams]

@PhilThanks

2 hours ago, Phil said:

Energy is love. 

I don't even know what that word means anymore. I also don't know how true that is. The energy can be transmuted into a loving kind of bliss but it isn't like that most of the time.

2 hours ago, Phil said:

Dissociation, disidentifying from thoughts, spiritual bypassing, and conceptualizing emotions is not recommended. That is the opposite of receiving the guidance and allowing interpretations to change (alignment of thoughts with feeling). 

What am I even supposed to do then?

 

[spiritual dreams]

16 hours ago, Phil said:

Do you have a dreamboard going? 

No, I don't know what I want anymore

16 hours ago, Phil said:

Is there a point to this madness? 

maybe? This shit deconditioned the shit out of me and I've learned a lot about my underlying ego mechanisms. 

[Phil]

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

@PhilThanks

I don't even know what that word means anymore. I also don't know how true that is. The energy can be transmuted into a loving kind of bliss but it isn't like that most of the time.

I’m not suggesting love means anything, is knowable, or can be transmuted or that there’s time.

Only that energy is a conceptualization of love / the actuality of “energy” is love. 

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

What am I even supposed to do then?

I’m not suggesting you’re supposed to do anything, but with respect to truth (love) & well-being (love) and alignment here are some suggestions:

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

No, I don't know what I want anymore

It’s not really possible to experience and there not be preferences. If you make a list of what you are sure you don’t want, it reveals a list of opposites… what you do want. 

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

maybe? This shit deconditioned the shit out of me and I've learned a lot about my underlying ego mechanisms. 

Write that list of what you do want on the dreamboard.

Get comfy with acknowledging and expressing emotions. It’s all grey. There’s no right or wrong. 

 

[spiritual dreams]

On 3/10/2024 at 8:27 PM, Phil said:

It’s not really possible to experience and there not be preferences. If you make a list of what you are sure you don’t want, it reveals a list of opposites… what you do want. 

Fair enough. I guess a big thing is that with my current situation, I don't know if what I want is ever going to happen and even it its possible, its not happening in a long time.

On 3/10/2024 at 8:27 PM, Phil said:

Get comfy with acknowledging and expressing emotions. It’s all grey. There’s no right or wrong. 

Thanks, doing this actually helped.  However i find it quite difficult sometimes. Many times I notice intense aversion to the emotion. Other times the emotion seems to have created an energetic cramp that feels like physical sensation. Finally, even if i acknowledge fear in one place, other parts of my energetic body seem to contract in fear.

[Phil]

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

Fair enough. I guess a big thing is that with my current situation, I don't know if what I want is ever going to happen and even it its possible, its not happening in a long time.

If you want, we can talk more specifically about whatever that is. 

 

Generally speaking…

If whatever that is were already the case, preferences would continue to arise, and there would be something else wanted. 

Whatever those preferences might be, would you be saying the same thing about them?

And the next, and the next, and the next and so on?

If you carry that all the way out… then what?

Perhaps that ‘then what’… would actually be, This, as is.

 

Put another way, there might be a hint of ‘This isn’t good enough as is because it isn’t that’. 

But This is not separate of feeling, This is feeling… and so discordant thoughts about This not being good enough, are felt & met with the guidance of emotion. 

 

It’s like if you drove to my house and at any point I called and asked where you were, you would never say ‘there’… always ‘here’. 

Even upon arriving at my house, if asked where you were, you would still say ‘here’. 

There is the reference to “there”, yet “there” is never actually experienced. 

 

Same for “that”. “That” isn’t in a future… “that” is actually This. 

So a thought about how This can’t be “that”, would feel discordant to… This. 

 

Make any sense? 

Questions?

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

Thanks, doing this actually helped.  However i find it quite difficult sometimes. Many times I notice intense aversion to the emotion. Other times the emotion seems to have created an energetic cramp that feels like physical sensation. Finally, even if i acknowledge fear in one place, other parts of my energetic body seem to contract in fear.

Noticing aversion & allowing suppressed emotion to be felt can indeed be challenging. It’s a lot like barfing. But it might seem to be more in thought, than it is actually experienced. 

 

Is there any time but now, any where but here… in which emotions are felt? 

Perhaps the framing is what seems & feels like - “a big thing”, and the actuality of feeling emotions is ‘smaller’, in that it’s now-only. 

 

Yes… ‘energetic cramp’ / bodily contraction. A discordant thought & bodily contraction simultaneously arise. They even correlate to specific muscles & organs etc. 

 

How does it feel (resonate or not) to acknowledge fear as an emotion… as opposed to a thing in a place, even if what’s meant by place is an area of the body? 

This points to discord being of the thoughts & interpretations, which can change, and therein the discord and contraction are lessened. 

 

How is meditation going specifically in terms of deep bodily relaxation? The discord of thought and contraction works ‘the other way’ too. A relaxed body makes for less discordant thoughts and if & when discordant thoughts arise, the aspect of the thought which is discordant is more readily ‘seen’. 

 

 

Also, how’s diet & exercise? That plays a significant role as well. 

[Blessed2]

On 3/10/2024 at 3:29 AM, Mandy said:

Stop conceptualizing it as kundalini.

 

@spiritual dreams That is great advice from Mandy.

 

Could be very helpful to drop conceptualizsation / interpretation 'kundalini'.

 

Just go back to good ol' emotions. And take the emotional scale with you.

 

In terms of emotions, what you're "going through" isn't really anything 'special'. (If that thought is comforting). Everyone feels emotions. Everyone are familiar with the emotions listed on the scale.

 

Allow it to be that simple. Good ol normal everyday fear. Good ol normal everyday overwhelment. Good ol normal everyday worry.

 

Keep the scale near, and keep checking in what the simple everyday emotion that is being felt is.

 

Oh, and the emotional scale encompasses the full range of emotions. You don't need any other map for emotions. No emotions are missing from the scale, and there is no need to add any that aren't listed in it. I'm not saying this to be dogmatic, but just to make it simple, grounded and straight-forward. I find this to be a helpful way to go.

 

Edited March 12 by Blessed2

[spiritual dreams]

On 3/12/2024 at 7:11 PM, Phil said:

Make any sense? 

Questions?

 

So, your saying the future I want doesn't exist. Because there is only this right?

On 3/12/2024 at 7:11 PM, Phil said:

How does it feel (resonate or not) to acknowledge fear as an emotion… as opposed to a thing in a place, even if what’s meant by place is an area of the body? 

This points to discord being of the thoughts & interpretations, which can change, and therein the discord and contraction are lessened. 

This might be a stupid question, but how exactly do I acknowledge fear as an emotion? Its quite difficult because I either only feel the energetic cramp with no fear, or I am completely identified with the fear, and aversion, plus intrusive compulsive thougths,

[Phil]

11 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

So, your saying the future I want doesn't exist. Because there is only this right?

No, it’s far worse than that. Not specifically the future you want doesn’t exist. A future doesn’t exist, at all.

 

There are thoughts about the future, and guidance is felt. Perhaps fear, worry, and or doubt. 

The guidance is for the thoughts. Not for a past, a future, a kundalini or a separate self. 

The thoughts. 

 

“Future” is a reference like “there”. No one has ever or will ever experience “there” or “a future”. Same for a “past”. Same for “kundalini”. 

 

Worse yet… 

As “there” isn’t actually a “there”… “there” isn’t even “this”.

This is, this. This is present-only. This is The Present. 

 

It’s a bit like if God-Love were giving itself a gift, and to be and receive this gift, God-Love has to forget or overlook itself - to be & receive The Gift. 

And so God-Love be’s the gift, as itself, for itself, and forgets / overlooks, itself.

And then no one is like “It’s The Present”, “It’s All For You”.

And God-Love is all, “No it’s my future! It’s my past! It’s my kundalini!” 

And God-Love is like, “It’s The Present! It’s all for ‘you’!”

And still, God-Love is like, “But a ‘Daniel Ingram’ calls The Present ‘kundalini’ & a ‘Phil’ calls The Present ‘conditioning’”. 

 

Conditioning points to the beliefs that there is a my past, my future, my kundalini, and no intrinsic guidance. 

“The beliefs” are thoughts, appearing now only… about… other-than-now. 

Conditions. 

 

Reality remains unconditional, appearing as, conditions. 

 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

About 6 months ago I awakened kundalini. I can only describe it as an intense energy that moves up the body which amplifies conscousness, awareness, emotions and thought patterns. Daniel Ingram calls it the arising and passing away, Phil I think called it the dissolving of conditioning, it doesn't really matter, just conceptual labels.

 

Since then it has fucked me up beyond recognition. 

Kundalini is a reference (like there, a past, a future) and isn’t actually  some thing which is separate of consciousness and amplifies consciousness or has any effect whatsoever on consciousness. That actuality of what the belief ‘kundalini’ is about - is consciousness. 

 

In accordance with thoughts, what’s separate is a finite self which is not present, and is ‘in’ linear time, which awakened kundalini 6 months ago. In accordance with reality, those are thoughts, presently appearing (or not). Kundalini is not the dissolving of conditioning. Kundalini, in the context of the OP, is conditioning. A, condition. “Emotions aren’t felt! It’s kundalini!”

 

Conditioning is the mistaken identity as “the one” which “isn’t consciousness”. “The one” which isn’t present-now, conscious of thoughts appearing now… which “kundalini is asserting upon”. 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

After the initial bliss states faded away I can only describe it as a bad trip that does not end

“States” is part & parcel of “a separate self”, “in time”, which is not consciousness… and “knows about consciousness”. 

The “knower” that “knows” there is “good & bad”, and “beginnings & endings”. 

These thoughts, that there are “states” and a “knower” that “knows there are states”… are… thoughts… which consciousness, which is present, and is conscious, of. 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

. It has taken me to hellish places that I would not wish on anybody and stripped away everything I held dear. All my beliefs, values and ways of looking at reality have been stripped away and revealed to be mental fabrications and wishful thinking. My underlying mental issues have been amplified to the point where it has taken over my whole life. I experience intense anxiety, despair, anger, unease, OCD, extreme worrying, dissociation and pretty much everything else on a daily basis. I have had to quit my job and move back in with my parents.

Instead of acknowledging thoughts presently experienced, and emotions presently experienced as guidance for thoughts… beliefs are employed like states, kundalini, a separate self, a hellish place, my underlying mental issues, my whole life, anxiety, ocd, extreme (worry), dissociation, and on a daily basis. So moving back in with parents isn’t an effect caused by beliefs. It’s the other than letting these conceptualizations (of emotions) go, and feeling emotions. 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

Before kundalini I believed in love, god, infinite consciousness, oneness etc... Now I realise those were all bullshit conceptualizations and fabrications I deluded myself into believing. I have also become aware of just how much suffering there was in me and how much suffering there is in the world. I cannot see the world as a good place. My worldview has dissolved so I don't know anything anymore. Is materialism true, idealism? buddhism? Leo's solipsism? phil's creator stuff? God? These are just mental fabrications. I don't know anything but my direct experience and I'm not even sure of that anymore. Even my sense of self and identity was also a fabrication.

 

“Before kundalini I believed in…”.  That is a / the belief. That is a thought about a separate self in time. “In” a past. Which believed, in a past.

These thoughts are experienced presently. 

As these thoughts are experienced, emotions are felt as guidance for these thoughts. 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

At the same time... I don't want to go back. Now that i have realised how deluded I was, I simply can't go back. I wasn't exactly having a good time before this either. My attatchment to my personal identity and story have decreased so I no longer care about petty ego shit as much which is incredibly freeing. Going back would be like going back into the matrix.

The separate self of thought is “the one which was deluded in a past but isn’t now”. Delusion needs a deluded self like the weather needs a weatherman. There’s experiential delusion, there is no one who’s deluded or not. “The one” which wasn’t having a good time before this, is this, appearing as the thought, about a separate self in time. 

 

Similarly, there isn’t any one which is in, or goes into, or get’s out of, The Matrix. You are not in a “room” right now. Heaven is within you. 

God-Love is appearing as if, making it seem to itself that it is, inside of some thing, such as a room, world, universe, etc. 

 

There isn’t “Phil’s creator stuff”. There’s no “Phil”. You are Being, being, “This”.  You are creator-creating-creation. FREE. Freedom “itself”. So free, you can believe in “states”, “kundalini”, that suffering is not how some thoughts feel but is some thing inside of you, and there is no guidance for these thoughts. 

 

On 3/9/2024 at 5:14 PM, spiritual dreams said:

I don't know how much longer this is going to last or whats going to happen to me but hey,

it is what it is...

Time’s a belief. Conditioning. There isn’t any thing happening to you. Experiential reality, creation, the present - is for you. 

You be creation (world-sphere). Not ‘some separate thing’ - your very being. 

 

As you are awareness / aware / self-aware… being a world-sphere doesn’t continue experience for you, because you’re aware there isn’t knowing, or a second thing, such as “a world-sphere”. 

 

To ‘experience a world’, you be, a lens-sphere, which veils you from your own eternally inherent formless infinitude, unconditionality & perfection….

and so it seems like there is “a world” or “a universe”.  

 

As, of said universe… there are let’s say “lost souls”, which ignore the intrinsic guidance, and believe in “states”, “kundalini”, “becoming enlightened”, “raising your consciousness”, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc. Like a wind up clapping monkey infinitely wound clapping, clapping, clapping endlessly as not to simply acknowledge and feel - emotions. If the intrinsic guidance were allowed, it’d be perfectly clear there is no “knower” (of states, kundalini, a separate self becoming, which has consciousness and can raise “it’s” consciousness, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc. Put another way… it’s all aversion from bringing thought (the monkey) to rest. Why? Emotions would be felt. 

 

11 hours ago, spiritual dreams said:

This might be a stupid question, but how exactly do I acknowledge fear as an emotion? Its quite difficult because I either only feel the energetic cramp with no fear, or I am completely identified with the fear, and aversion, plus intrusive compulsive thougths,

By acknowleding what is already felt, and that emotions are a separate of consciousness self, in linear time, which knows there are states, and which kundalini fucked up.

 

Self is present, and emotions are experienced presently. The believing of the thoughts about another, second, separate self… “the one” separate of, and knowing & understanding consciousness….    is the aversion from emotion(s) felt… presently. 

 

Emotion in intrinsic guidance, for / about, the very thoughts, about there being a separate self, which knows & understands, and which was fucked up by kundalini. While there isn’t that separate self, or a thing such as ‘kundalini’…  there is consciousness, conscious / awareness, aware… and present. 

[spiritual dreams]

Ok wow that's a lot to unpack.

On 3/14/2024 at 1:16 PM, Phil said:

By acknowleding what is already felt, and that emotions are a separate of consciousness self, in linear time, which knows there are states, and which kundalini fucked up.

 

Self is present, and emotions are experienced presently. The believing of the thoughts about another, second, separate self… “the one” separate of, and knowing & understanding consciousness….    is the aversion from emotion(s) felt… presently. 

 

Emotion in intrinsic guidance, for / about, the very thoughts, about there being a separate self, which knows & understands, and which was fucked up by kundalini. While there isn’t that separate self, or a thing such as ‘kundalini’…  there is consciousness, conscious / awareness, aware… and present. 

This is understood intellectually but actually being able to do this is really difficult since identification with separate self is such a deeply entrenched habit. What does it even mean to acknowledge emotions? I just can't seem to do it properly. There is always an aversion. And sometimes and aversion to aversion which creates even more aversion...

[Jonas Long]

4 minutes ago, spiritual dreams said:

Ok wow that's a lot to unpack.

This is understood intellectually but actually being able to do this is really difficult since identification with separate self is such a deeply entrenched habit. What does it even mean to acknowledge emotions? I just can't seem to do it properly. There is always an aversion. And sometimes and aversion to aversion which creates even more aversion...

All aversion ever really is is aversion to aversion. 

[Phil]

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

Ok wow that's a lot to unpack.

This is understood intellectually but actually being able to do this is really difficult since identification with separate self is such a deeply entrenched habit.

Being aware that these are thoughts about an intellectual understander and doer truly is ample. 

Being aware that ‘deeply entrenched habit’ is a thought is ample as well. 

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

What does it even mean to acknowledge emotions?

Let meaning be an altogether different inquiry or endeavor, having nothing to do with acknowledging emotions felt. 

 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

I just can't seem to do it properly.

Being aware of (separate) self referential thoughts is ample as well. 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

There is always an aversion.

But you’re present & aware of thoughts about time and a separate self (of thoughts) in time. 

1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said:

And sometimes and aversion to aversion which creates even more aversion...

Also thoughts. 

 

These response could seem sarcastic or dismissive, but this is indeed ‘how’. 

[Phil]

What are your thoughts on the main staples? 

Dreamboard. Emotional Scale. Diet & exercise. Daily meditation. 

 

Look at the list here… see what you’re experiencing, and notice the emotion.