Serenity

I get confused on all support ☹️. Overall, it requires me a lot of attention when it comes to understanding the stuff that goes beyond what I already see. 😔 That's because you've never said such things. 🙂

I am in the situation where I can't even tell where to look: Isn't this exactly what I am saying? My point was that working with the Jungian model starts with this belief, which is a false one. Phil's non dual bingo: Carl Jung doesn't exist You're talking about an ego that doesn't exist The shadow doesn't exist You are factually wrong about Carl Jung's model of the shadow Semantics All of this together 🤷‍♀️ I suppose I am going to keep guessing which one it is.

If my Dreamboard include helping a maximum of person through a model they can understand, how am I suppose to do it with these technics when even I and most of the forum still have difficulties integrating your teachings? I am not saying they are not qualitative, as I am benefiting a lot from your insights, but it's a bit of a 'to be conscious, you've got to be conscious' deal to me and I keep on seeing only parts of your points here and there. It also wouldn't be the first time you'll hear this, I am sure. 😕

I didn't state Jung framed shadow work (which is a terminology he didn't use) as a concession to Truth. I said that I am saying that any work assuming there is an ego is a concession to Truth. Which is also something that I am pretty sure I have seen you writing in another post, somewhere? And yes, Jung did frame the shadow as a separate entity from the ego self, and had diverses theories revolving around diverses autonomous parts. Whether he used the word 'parts' himself or not I can't recall, but he definitely talked about conflicting agendas between different elements of the psyche, which is what matters. So I am sincerely confused about why you are saying all of this?

Thank you! You are welcome. 😀

While Carl Jung undoubtedly contributed to the understanding and popularization of shadow work within modern psychology by theorizing and developing a model for it, solely attributing its origin to him would be reductive. It's important to recognize that the concept of shadow work existed before Jung's exploration and that there's a phenomenon of "columbusing" involved in claiming it as his discovery. However, it's worth noting that Jung coined the terminology of "the shadow," even though he didn't explicitly use the phrase "shadow work" to describe the process, as far as I am aware. There are numerous cultures that have never been exposed to the teachings of Carl Jung yet possess a profound understanding of the shadow. This idea is evident in various cultural and religious texts, including the Bible. For instance, there's a passage that alludes to it: "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye?" This line illustrates the phenomenon of shadow projection. What I mean by that is, the shadow isn't something invented or created like a tangible device; rather, it's something discovered within oneself, as something that is already there existing. Just like the concept of the ego. I believe Phil isn't particularly fond of the concept of shadow work, and I suspect I understand why. Shadow work begins with a significant concession to Truth: it postulates that there is a distinct self, an ego, that has rejected another part of itself. This concession, however, keeps those who practice it within the framework or loop of the ego, which can be problematic, at least momentarily. So, in a nutshell, shadow work is the process of expanding the ego to align one's self-concept more closely with the reality (actuality) of what someone truly is. This is why I theorize that gradually incorporating a non-dual perspective into shadow work represents a very legitimate gradual path toward enlightenment. Properly done shadow work should lead the ego to burst it's bubble. The reason I prefer this approach over some more typical Advaita Vedanta/Neo-Advaita, which often focuses on 'Who Am I?', is that the shadow work route helps to avoid the pitfalls of Zen sickness and spiritual bypassing commonly associated with a more Divine Masculine leaning path. Moreover, it is rooted in integrating the non-dual perspective into emotions, the body, and earthly experiences rather than simply 'transcending' them. It is bit more of an ascending path than a descending path, and this suits me well. Shadow work also could be defined as the gradual process of clearing repression stemming from the survival mechanisms within us. These mechanisms shield what seems to be a separate self from merging into the whole, which start to kick in during childhood development. As we navigate life, we find ourselves entangled in a pattern of choosing between survival and authenticity, frequently sacrificing the latter. This results in accumulating a 'repression debt' that necessitates acknowledgment and exploration to reconnect with our authentic selves. Eventually, this quest converges with the realization that our authentic self is indeed the Self.

I don't believe in avoiding directness or disregarding common sense for the sake of Absolute truth, when it's not essential. Logic and rationality, though limited, are of use in the context described and in most of mundane life.

Lol. Yes. I am wondering quite often when to participate and when just let stuff be lately. Saying nothing when outrageous things are said (ex: sadistic post of someone enjoying war crime) or deluded impostors take themselves for teachers comes off to me as as weird as trying to help people integrate a new healthier perspective when there is seemingly no will or readiness to introspect. I think I somewhat like better to 'debate' than the first option though. It's less dysfunctional than letting unconsciousness rule and run amok.

@Phil Maybe not the most appropriate moment and circumstances to ask, but would you and your wife be opened to make a video or talk about your relationship in some ways? 🙂

duality

People would require an illusion of a self and many other selves, which doesn't make sense in pure unity. 🤍

OCD stems from an unconscious unaddressed shame issue, which generates intrusives self-referential thoughts in the conscious mind. Source: I've had OCD crisis (Pure O). As of now, they are gone. 🙌

The "Dark Masculine" is NOT in most people's shadow as 1) we currently live in a patriarchal society 2) toxic masculinity is so rampant that it is both used in academic and media to describe a predominant problematic pattern in society. Toxic masculinity is what is currently at the forefront. From Trump to Peterson, to incels or the vibe at Actualized.org, all of that are exemple of it.

@Reena @Reena I don't know if I've ever been a woman who hates men. But I have, for a while, harbored a lot of disdain and anger for the patriarchy😬. Resolving any animosity towards men (which isn't really my thing, as I tend to single out and recognize immature males rather than stigmatizing the whole group) came down to two things: Clearing out my insecurities, narratives, and all kinds of traumas that might make me more prone to attracting men with poorly integrated feminine traits. Working on my boundaries, finding a deeper sense of self-worth, and allowing myself to receive the truly good things in life seems to be yielding much better results. Engaging with archetypes and learning to recognize healthy masculine characteristics. You can even experience significant transformation and healing through parasocial relationships, so I wouldn't hesitate to seek out positive male role models online and trust that you'll attract more of them into your life, whether as friends, colleagues, potential spouses, or whatever. Truly, I now swiftly ignore any guy showing red flags. I regret this the most, as my intuition has always been correct in such matters, but often my unconscious would take over and keep me in a situation that wasn't worth it (patterns of trying to prove one's worth, feeling unworthy, suppressing one's power to manage someone's feelings, empathetic codependency, etc.). Focusing and deciding to engage only with men who are treating you right is the way out. You can leave the other ones to their karmic shithole and prey they get out of it, eventually growing the pool of the healthy, nice men.

An illusion

Yes, that's another perspective on it. But it seems to me that this addition matches the reply. I am not sure whether 'the past' always pertains to the ego or not (though it is always a concept, it can be discussed without direct self-reference for practical purposes), but self-referential thoughts and feelings about a past self always involve the ego. Therefore, they can feel very real for the identified self, but they are ultimately just illusions experienced by the whole, perfect, unified consciousness.

Because negative self-referential thoughts and feelings feel bad and they are believed in when they arise. Of course, they are only ego, and the SELF, which is actually who I am is full and is the one who is and have everything I am looking for. I think I answered my own question thanks to this question you asked me. What do you think of it? 🤗

🤍 @Phil Thanks again for being this forum's dad. Much love.

I had past as 'from the past' in mind. While I conceptually know the past is gone, the emotions are still kept alive in the present moment because they seemingly were suppressed and are still to be felt and accepted. But there is also a wish to go through it, 'past it' in the second sense of the word and finally be released of that energy.

I'm referring to viewing everything through the prism of that emotion, which can lead to attracting a narrowed-down, corresponding reality due to the tunnel vision effect.

From my experience, embarrassement do lead to consequences as it attracts its own reality when it does consume you. It doesn't happen if you manage to dismantle it when it arises, though.

So, how do you reconcile having already or being already what you're looking for with expressing/feeling past negative self-referential thoughts/emotions? I can entertain pretty well two seemingly different ideas at the same time, but I am having a hard time with emotional paradoxes like this 🫠. @Phil 🤍🥹 (Btw, Phil -> FEEL, coincidence? 😆😲)

Self-humiliation isn't just about what objectively happens. It's also about how we personally perceive it. What might feel super embarrassing to you might not bother me at all and vice versa. Up to this day, I still find myself carrying a heavy load of shame. So when I take a moment to introspect, I often uncover past neglected wounds that I've been avoiding. They feel like diving into a bottomless pool of self-rejection and hatred, where no healing is possible. I find it fascinating how people react so differently to situations where shame could kick in as a social tool. Like, one person might brush off something that would leave me feeling totally embarrassed, while they walk away without a scratch socially. And that exact same thing could send me spiraling into a whirlwind of distress and embarrassment, making everyone around feel uneasy as well. What does make the difference? The triggering and sinking into one of these inner pool of self-hatred, which stem obviously from past trauma. A bunch of unattended, self-referential thoughts and emotions taking possession of the sense of self, when they are usually well buried away down in the shadow. You could try embarrassing yourself by lying there in the middle of Starbucks. I have a friend who would do it and act like it's no big deal and convince without a single word everyone around that there is nothing weird in that. That same friend took the bar exam in my hometown and ranked first because any sense of shame seems to roll off him like water off a duck's back. Shame is a matter of projection. And I believe that achieving true freedom from it involves addressing past emotional debts by sitting with oneself and admitting how much we do not accept ourselves after a lifetime of feeling unloved by others as we are, and then becoming the ones who reject us. Every past negative self-referential thought and feeling must be cleared up by our now mature, unconditionally loving heart. The only antidote to shame is self-love, transitioning from seeing oneself as 'broken' or 'not enough' to recognizing oneself as the Beloved. You must learn to love what you've always failed to love about yourself. Learn mercy, compassion, vulnerability... All of that is easier said than done. The lady writing this post has got the theory, but isn't fully there yet. 🥴 ❤️‍🔥

Love you too, Phil!

My 30mn break More than well invested.