Is chivalry dead?

[Blessed2]

@Mandy Beauty very much seems to be separate, yes.

 

Your comment kind of triggered me for some reason 😄

 

Not really interested in thinking or trying to figure out or arrive in some insight. Have tried that for years, and there has not been a moment of just sitting and being one with all the beauty and sex. So it does in fact seem like it is in separate things and people, and thus I can be and am unfulfilled.

 

Same with many things. Music. Art. Nature. Even magical creatures like gnomes and fairies etc. Would like to be with them forever. Would like to really be connected. Would like to be fulfilled. But it really does seem like maybe an impossible task. Uncertain. Unlikely, even. So yeah, would like to own these things, would like to have it so that there wouldn't be this pain.

 

 

[Mandy]

@Blessed2 Imagine that you're at an event and you see this woman. Instantly you're attracted and gravitated toward her. Someone across the room yells "Rebecca" and she turns around and has a brief conversation with the person behind her. To your surprise you're paired up with her, and she doesn't disappoint, you're head over heels for her. The event is almost over and you know you won't see her again and you want to express how you feel, and to see if she wants to see you again. During your lunch you write a sweet and clever note for her beginning with her name and leave your number. You hand it to her, and immediately see that she has a huge frown across her face, then a look of amusement. You feel a horrible feeling in your gut as you feel mortified and you decide that she hates you and you've done something stupid. But it turns out that her name isn't Rebecca. It was a strange coincidence how you assumed her name was that, but no, it's actually Alice. You made an innocent mistake. In your infatuation, you might have missed some clues along the way. But now, this instant, is all that matters. She does like you, the mistake in the note doesn't matter and now it's time to laugh it off. The look on her face wasn't personal, had nothing to do with how she felt about you, but was simply the recognition of a misunderstanding. It was all based on an innocent misunderstanding. But if you walk off you'll never realize that the look on her face has nothing to do with how she felt about you you, but was a reaction to an innocent misunderstanding. 

 

It's like we are sailors believing the earth is flat and contriving a system to prevent us from sailing off the earth. We are told that this concern is unfounded, but cannot accept the truth that the earth is round in fear that all that work and toil will be lost, while totally missing the relief that the security we wanted to achieve through our effort is already in effect, and we are already and at this moment free to sail where we want. 

 

That we are our bodies, our gender, and our minds, separate selves, is the innocent misunderstanding, but oh holy mother of Jesus, is it a ever big one. It's the house built upon the sand. That there are beautiful people and ugly people, that we can be loved or rejected, that we can own people, that love is conditional, will never be fulfilling. We cannot manipulate those beliefs into fulfilling us. No amount of make up, boob jobs, nose jobs, tanning, or learning to act confident or cool, or learning game is going to fix that house upon the sand misunderstanding and result is the sought unconditional fulfillment.

 

Ownership is always conditional. A thing must first be separate from you in order for you to own it. 

 

You feel bad when you take things personally, when you focus on a sense of lack.  You have feeling guidance, when you think a thought based on this misunderstanding. It's not a search for new insight, it's just correcting a false understanding and no longer taking the false understanding personally, because the separate person was the false misunderstanding. 

 

A woman who arrogantly rejects and believes she is too beautiful for a man feels the discord of her own objectifying herself. He wrongly takes this to be a personal failing and feels the discord of his misunderstanding. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Eothasian]

@Mandy

I want to say mandy, you have really good psychological insight. 

 

What about a man, who believes he is not good enough for a woman?

[Mandy]

@Eothasian There's just as many women believing they aren't good enough for them. It would be great if we would all stop overlooking each other. When we focus on what we can't have, it's all we see, and we overlook the love and beauty that is present. 

[Eothasian]

1 minute ago, Mandy said:

When we focus on what we can't have, it's all we see, and we overlook the love and beauty that is present. 

I absolutely agree.

 

I wasn't making a stance for the converse direction.

But that's a good answer as well.

 

[Blessed2]

@Mandy You humble me (in the most wonderful way)

 

[Faith]

10 hours ago, Blessed2 said:

Not really interested in thinking or trying to figure out or arrive in some insight.

 

As you get older your point of view will probably change on this. I'd say just be open to it and not totally closed off.

 

Yes, I know about incels, since you asked and they express lots of rage and often violence towards women. 

Sorry this is short, but I've pretty much  expressed what I had to say already about the topic throughout the thread. 

 

Good luck to you.

 

[Blessed2]

3 hours ago, Faith said:

As you get older your point of view will probably change on this. I'd say just be open to it and not totally closed off.

 

I'm not closed off. That's the point. That's why I wrote the post.

 

[Phil]

On 8/14/2022 at 10:35 AM, Faith said:

So, I wasn't blaming this forum for these type of threads, so much as maybe saying that they really just are not appropriate, imo, on a spiritual form that has men AND women on it.  I personally don't want to read that crap. It was unfortunately acceptable on Actualized.org and so here we are again. 🙄

Just to clarify… I agree completely, and didn’t mean this thread, but what this thread was addressing. Seems like a carry over of seeking via objectifying / state chasing purported as nondual insight basically. I find it fair to say it wasn’t only accepted but was the overall doctrine preached. 

[Faith]

 Just sayin' 🤷‍♀️

 

[Faith]

10 hours ago, Devin said:

@Faith and you say the men on here are the sexist ones

I never said men are sexist. I said chivalry is dead. If a guy asks a woman out and can't buy her a plate of food I think that's pathetic. 

 

"Definition of Sexism is prejudice or discrimination based on one's sex or gender". 

 

Maybe the clip should have been used in a different thread if you think it was sexist (oh well), but I won't remove it now, since you already commented. 

[Phil]

Is chivalry dead?

(Pauses wife’s foot rub): No. 

[Faith]

26 minutes ago, Phil said:

Is chivalry dead?

(Pauses wife’s foot rub): No. 

 

🤣

 

I bet you bought her a plate a food when dating too! 

 

 

[Faith]

48 minutes ago, Devin said:

he must buy me a meal", it's very unaccepting of men, he can't just be him?

 

No, he can't. Sorry 😂

[Phil]

17 minutes ago, Faith said:

🤣

I bet you bought her a plate a food when dating too! 

😂 Actually… I forgot my wallet the very first date we had, and she paid. True story. Apparently I’m great at forgetting. 🤷 

But I’m with ya, I totally would, and did many times. I still would if any of ‘our’ money was mine! 😂  

[Faith]

38 minutes ago, Phil said:

I still would if any of ‘our’ money was mine! 😂  

Hehe! 🤣

 

Good man!!!

 

[Faith]

14 minutes ago, Devin said:

Okay well women with that perspective should tell the man up front

Personally, I did. I had a guy call me back in the day and ask me out for pizza. I said, sure. He said but I have no money. I said never mind then, you asked me out, therefore I'd expect you are paying. 

 

Anyways, it didn't mean I wanted him for his money, how much is a plate of food? I find it chivalrous to pay for dinner.

 

22 minutes ago, Devin said:

Most women will have sex without a meal, you're in the minority

 

You seem to know from experience. You want to find your girlfriend or prospective wife like that?

 

Have at it! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mandy]

I'm not sure why dates classically include restaurants in the first place. Restaurants are one of the least interesting places you could possibly go in my opinion, but I guess it makes sense that everyone gets hungry eventually. 😆I think it's a bit sad that today's world has few public safe places you can meet where you aren't expected to spend money. Like, we could collectively do much better. 

[Orb]

@Mandy I agree 100% 

 

Everyone wants to eat somewhere! 

 

Why not going for a walk in a park, a picnic, watching a sunset, hanging out at a beach, idk just cheaper more natural ways of sharing time together.

[Faith]

@Mandy @Orb

That's all fine and dandy, I got no problem with that, but really my point was these guys that ask someone for a date and the date winds up being just sitting in their bedroom, drinking water and getting groped for sex. Ack. 

 

I'm so glad my millennial son didn't treat women like that. I don't care if it was an ice cream cone after going to the park, his ass was paying for it if he was on a date!