Are psychedelics a huge waste of time.

[Kevin]

So I tripped yesterday and like many trips my mind is blown and it feels like I wake up. and by that I don’t mean Kevin wakes up.  I mean whatever I am wakes up to itself and it’s all love and it’s only now. And there’s no doubt that it’s always now and it’s absolute love and it’s beautiful.

 

I’ve been having these trips for years and like 95% of the time when I come down and. Go to bed. I wake up the next day totally normal.

 

I guess I wish I was drowning In love and bliss and it just doesn’t seem like psychedelics are doing the trick.

[WhiteOwl]

After ecstasy, the laundry. 

 

Psychedelics for me seems to be useful for contacting and healing trauma, if you listen to them and let them guide you. They can guide you into difficult emotions, but just like when you are not tripping, its about being in the body and not just floating in your mind. I've had trips that felt very good where i was dreaming away, but the most healing ones are the present ones being here now. 

 

 

[Kevin]

8 minutes ago, WhiteOwl said:

After ecstasy, the laundry. 

 

Psychedelics for me seems to be useful for contacting and healing trauma, if you listen to them and let them guide you. They can guide you into difficult emotions, but just like when you are not tripping, its about being in the body and not just floating in your mind. I've had trips that felt very good where i was dreaming away, but the most healing ones are the present ones being here now. 

 

 

Facts I guess I’ve always been trying to speed through the laundry

[Phil]

It’s a noticing of (separate) self referential thoughts. 

 

4 hours ago, Kevin said:

by that I don’t mean Kevin wakes up.  I mean whatever I am wakes up to itself and it’s all love and it’s only now. And there’s no doubt that it’s always now and it’s absolute love and it’s beautiful.

There it’s noticed. 

 

4 hours ago, Kevin said:

I’ve been having these trips for years and like 95% of the time when I come down and. Go to bed. I wake up the next day totally normal.

 

I guess I wish I was drowning In love and bliss and it just doesn’t seem like psychedelics are doing the trick.

There it isn’t. Not to ‘pick on anyone’ or anything, but the hijack of waking up is sort of a clue or red flag. As in it was noted infinite being, you, wake up (not a “Kevin”), but then there’s the thought about sleep on behalf of a Kevin, and waking up on behalf of a Kevin. There’s no sleeping Kevin scenario actually experienced anymore than there is (as you noted) a Kevin awakening experienced. The appearing & disappearing is that perfect & you are that perfection. It’s so intimate, ‘up close’, all encompassing, that “it”, the actuality of the ‘situation’ goes unnoticed / is ‘veiled by the thoughts / narrative. 

 

The one those thoughts are about simply isn’t. There is only the thoughts. The thoughts are like clouds that obscure what the psychedelic (seemingly) un-obscurres. No one took psychedelics in the first place / there really aren’t any. 

 

The apparent / illusory finite mind only has one fundamental ‘mission’ and it’s to bring itself to rest / dispel itself of itself. ‘It’ concocts scenarios in which it is presumed it’s ’away from’ Being, and naturally then concocts scenarios in which it’s ’closer to’ Being. Like reasons to stress, worry, etc, and then seeking peak experiences / thrills, psychedelics, objectifying relationships, etc. Nothing wrong with any of it of course.

 

There’s the old pointing reference about this, I think from Alan Watt’s (allegedly lol)… about hanging up the phone when you get the message. It’s indicative of emptying, de-conditioning, no more ‘rollercoaster’ / wheel of samsara / state chasing etc. All that remains is as you said, love, bliss… inherent peacefulness. 

 

Idk if this ‘lands’ but… psychedelics are the ‘lessor trip’, like the so called finite mind is the ‘lessor mind’. Reality as is is the Real, actual trip. Like a Full On Vacation without even actually leaving or moving.  Truly, there are only “psychedelics” for the separate self of thoughts (which there isn’t / it’s just the thought(s) ™️).

 

Are psychedelics a waste of time?

Wtf is “time”? 

😆

 

The key perhaps is there’s no “laundry”! That’d be “going right back to sleep”. There’s only the apparent thought that there is (something separate / other than consciousness such as laundry / chopping wood). Remember, you’re the Buddha - you comedian! There’s actually no mechanisms at all. Electricity / energy (consciousness) is not “inside of wires”. The surface seen if you will, (“washing machine”) is it. There’s no wires or parts inside. Unless you look… then there will appear to be. Just like the washing machine. One framing is, how utterly unnecessary it would be to appear as more than what’s directly experienced. Another contemplative framing… a third sphere? Why? What for?

[Kevin]

1 hour ago, Phil said:

It’s a noticing of (separate) self referential thoughts. 

 

There it’s noticed. 

 

There it isn’t. Not to ‘pick on anyone’ or anything, but the hijack of waking up is sort of a clue or red flag. As in it was noted infinite being, you, wake up (not a “Kevin”), but then there’s the thought about sleep on behalf of a Kevin, and waking up on behalf of a Kevin. There’s no sleeping Kevin scenario actually experienced anymore than there is (as you noted) a Kevin awakening experienced. The appearing & disappearing is that perfect & you are that perfection. It’s so intimate, ‘up close’, all encompassing, that “it”, the actuality of the ‘situation’ goes unnoticed / is ‘veiled by the thoughts / narrative. 

 

The one those thoughts are about simply isn’t. There is only the thoughts. The thoughts are like clouds that obscure what the psychedelic (seemingly) un-obscurres. No one took psychedelics in the first place / there really aren’t any. 

 

The apparent / illusory finite mind only has one fundamental ‘mission’ and it’s to bring itself to rest / dispel itself of itself. ‘It’ concocts scenarios in which it is presumed it’s ’away from’ Being, and naturally then concocts scenarios in which it’s ’closer to’ Being. Like reasons to stress, worry, etc, and then seeking peak experiences / thrills, psychedelics, objectifying relationships, etc. Nothing wrong with any of it of course.

 

There’s the old pointing reference about this, I think from Alan Watt’s (allegedly lol)… about hanging up the phone when you get the message. It’s indicative of emptying, de-conditioning, no more ‘rollercoaster’ / wheel of samsara / state chasing etc. All that remains is as you said, love, bliss… inherent peacefulness. 

 

Idk if this ‘lands’ but… psychedelics are the ‘lessor trip’, like the so called finite mind is the ‘lessor mind’. Reality as is is the Real, actual trip. Like a Full On Vacation without even actually leaving or moving.  Truly, there are only “psychedelics” for the separate self of thoughts (which there isn’t / it’s just the thought(s) ™️).

 

Are psychedelics a waste of time?

Wtf is “time”? 

😆

 

The key perhaps is there’s no “laundry”! That’d be “going right back to sleep”. There’s only the apparent thought that there is (something separate / other than consciousness such as laundry / chopping wood). Remember, you’re the Buddha - you comedian! There’s actually no mechanisms at all. Electricity / energy (consciousness) is not “inside of wires”. The surface seen if you will, (“washing machine”) is it. There’s no wires or parts inside. Unless you look… then there will appear to be. Just like the washing machine. One framing is, how utterly unnecessary it would be to appear as more than what’s directly experienced. Another contemplative framing… a third sphere? Why? What for?

Most of this is very clear. I am experiencing frustration because the love and bliss is obscured and it seems clear that any doing or solving is counterproductive.

 

I just realized there is guilt. Tremendous guilt that I’m not feeling it. The thoughts are if I were better it would be felt and recognized.

 

the one part I’m unclear on is the whole third sphere thing. I guess I don’t understand the spheres because every time you mention the spheres it sounds solipsistic.

[Phil]

@Kevin

I just meant there would be no need for a third sphere. All that’s necessary for there to be experience is a world(sphere) and a lens(sphere). Solipsism is a concept, a thought, which appears of / in the lens(sphere). Understanding is also a thought which appears of / in the lens(sphere). The knower / understander of solipsism is an illusory perspective on behalf of a separate (of you, consciousness, awareness) self… which “knows” and or “understands” consciousness, awareness. 

 

Love / bliss is you, and therein doesn’t / didn’t go anywhere. Love / bliss / you is being This. Is This. 

 

What might be obscuring is the thought(s) that there is, that you are, a doer or solver. Maybe there are underlying thoughts about that you aren’t enough as is, and so something needs to be done, which would be productive, resulting in love / bliss / you. In the best way possible… that simply can’t pan out. You can’t get from you to you. There is only to realize the truth; doer and solver are thoughts, not an actual self or entity. 

 

Best news possible… you’re not an it, a thing or object, an I… which could feel an “it”. 

You are it, and you’re free, already. 

 

Love / bliss is you, and you’re being a body as it were. So in a pointer / pointing sense… love / bliss is ‘in the bones’. A matter of de-tensing, de-contracting deeply, all muscles, all the way down to the bones. Let discordant thoughts go simply because of how they feel. Let em go swiftly, prior to entangling in any solver, doer, fixer  narrative. Not ‘stepping in the same whole’ / ‘going down the same street’. In this case there is less tension / contraction ‘added’ in the first place, and therefore less relaxation / letting go to feel as yourself; love, bliss. 

[Blessed2]

7 hours ago, Kevin said:

Most of this is very clear. I am experiencing frustration because the love and bliss is obscured and it seems clear that any doing or solving is counterproductive.

 

I just realized there is guilt. Tremendous guilt that I’m not feeling it. The thoughts are if I were better it would be felt and recognized.

 

The activity of selfing (or ego) hijacks or filters everything it comes to contact with through it's filters. It happens totally automatically and mechanically.

 

Basically, what-you-are-not claims what-you-are as an experience or knowledge a you has or gains in time.

 

It's not your (Kevin's) fault, at all. Kevin is not doing that activity. Kevin is not doing ego. It's the other way around. Kevin is being done by the activity. (Not "done" in the dirty way btw.)

 

Kevin isn't taking himself to be Kevin. It's absolutely not your fault. That you are not good enough or that you are not doing enough or should be doing more couldn't be further from the truth.

 

Edited April 12 by Blessed2

[Kevin]

10 hours ago, Phil said:

@Kevin

I just meant there would be no need for a third sphere. All that’s necessary for there to be experience is a world(sphere) and a lens(sphere). Solipsism is a concept, a thought, which appears of / in the lens(sphere). Understanding is also a thought which appears of / in the lens(sphere). The knower / understander of solipsism is an illusory perspective on behalf of a separate (of you, consciousness, awareness) self… which “knows” and or “understands” consciousness, awareness. 

 

Ah gotcha.

 

10 hours ago, Phil said:

Love / bliss is you, and therein doesn’t / didn’t go anywhere. Love / bliss / you is being This. Is This. 

 

What might be obscuring is the thought(s) that there is, that you are, a doer or solver. Maybe there are underlying thoughts about that you aren’t enough as is, and so something needs to be done, which would be productive, resulting in love / bliss / you. In the best way possible… that simply can’t pan out. You can’t get from you to you. There is only to realize the truth; doer and solver are thoughts, not an actual self or entity. 

 

Yes I think the confusion is thinking the doer/solver which is Kevin, needs to realize there is no doer/solver. In other words someone needs to realize this. And somehow this is aversion.

 

 

10 hours ago, Phil said:

Best news possible… you’re not an it, a thing or object, an I… which could feel an “it”. 

You are it, and you’re free, already. 

 

Love / bliss is you, and you’re being a body as it were. So in a pointer / pointing sense… love / bliss is ‘in the bones’. A matter of de-tensing, de-contracting deeply, all muscles, all the way down to the bones. Let discordant thoughts go simply because of how they feel. Let em go swiftly, prior to entangling in any solver, doer, fixer  narrative. Not ‘stepping in the same whole’ / ‘going down the same street’. In this case there is less tension / contraction ‘added’ in the first place, and therefore less relaxation / letting go to feel as yourself; love, bliss. 

Beautiful thanks.

 

I just watched inside out. It’s a beautiful movie, I highly recommend it. But it’s about a girls emotions personified. Basically it reminded me of my childhood and how certain memories are so painful because they are about what happened to me. All the pain is because of what happened to “me”. And all the pain now is happening to “me”.

 

And the solving of it all seems so crucial.

 

I just realized I think the solving is aversion. That’s what it has to be. Major lightbulb moment. If I try to solve my parents not loving and being there for me then I’m solidifying that belief and suppressing emotion.

[Kevin]

7 hours ago, Blessed2 said:

 

The activity of selfing (or ego) hijacks or filters everything it comes to contact with through itsfilters. It happens totally automatically and mechanically.

 

This is apparent for sure. When I feel good it seems like a beautiful painting is being painted. When I feel bad it seems like a terrible painting is being painted. Clearly there is nothing about a situation inherently terrible or beautiful that makes me feel that way.

 

I wish it was always a beautiful painting.

 

7 hours ago, Blessed2 said:

Basically, what-you-are-not claims what-you-are as an experience or knowledge a you has or gains in time.

 

thanks this really clicks thank you. How to stop tho? Meditation?

 

 

7 hours ago, Blessed2 said:

It's not your (Kevin's) fault, at all. Kevin is not doing that activity. Kevin is not doing ego. It's the other way around. Kevin is being done by the activity. (Not "done" in the dirty way btw.)

 

Kevin isn't taking himself to be Kevin. It's absolutely not your fault. That you are not good enough or that you are not doing enough or should be doing more couldn't be further from the truth.

 

❤️

[Mandy]

8 minutes ago, Kevin said:

This is apparent for sure. When I feel good it seems like a beautiful painting is being painted. When I feel bad it seems like a terrible painting is being painted. Clearly there is nothing about a situation inherently terrible or beautiful that makes me feel that way.

 

 

❤️

What if it's always a blank canvas, a clear slate? 

[Phil]

@Kevin

 

 

 

 

The “Wisher” 😂 

[Blessed2]

6 minutes ago, Kevin said:

thanks this really clicks thank you. How to stop tho? Meditation?

 

You can't really stop it. You are it.

 

"Self can't get out of self."

 

No need to get out, just recognize you're already not in.

 

 

Satsang (non-duality meetings, books, forums etc.) are like gun fire at the target. The activity of claiming catches almost all of those bullets like a hockey goalie, but even one of them oughta get through. Then it may be claimed a bit later as a "breakthrough / spiritual experience", but the target was hit and the goalie is a bit weaker every time.

 

Paul Hedderman's zoom calls and youtube videos are like full auto machine gun fire. They're great.

 

Meditation helps to slow down the activity of thought. It makes the activity of claiming go a bit drunk and now the goalie fumbles a bit.

 

 

[Kevin]

34 minutes ago, Mandy said:

What if it's always a blank canvas, a clear slate? 

Ah 💡

[Kevin]

11 minutes ago, Blessed2 said:

 

You can't really stop it. You are it.

 

"Self can't get out of self."

 

No need to get out, just recognize you're already not in.

 

 

Satsang (non-duality meetings, books, forums etc.) are like gun fire at the target. The activity of claiming catches almost all of those bullets like a hockey goalie, but even one of them oughta get through. Then it may be claimed a bit later as a "breakthrough / spiritual experience", but the target was hit and the goalie is a bit weaker every time.

 

Paul Hedderman's zoom calls and youtube videos are like full auto machine gun fire. They're great.

 

Meditation helps to slow down the activity of thought. It makes the activity of claiming go a bit drunk and now the goalie fumbles a bit.

 

 

How do I join Paul heddermans lives? Is it on his YouTube?

[Blessed2]

4 minutes ago, Kevin said:

How do I join Paul heddermans lives? Is it on his YouTube?

 

They are recorded and uploaded to his youtube channel ZenBitchslap.

 

Here are the upcoming zoom meetings: https://www.zenbitchslap.com/events

 

[Kevin]

5 minutes ago, Blessed2 said:

 

They are recorded and uploaded to his youtube channel ZenBitchslap.

 

Here are the upcoming zoom meetings: https://www.zenbitchslap.com/events

 

Thanks man. Much appreciated.

[Blessed2]

@Kevin This is a good one: 

 

 

[Kevin]

@Blessed2

On 4/13/2024 at 5:30 AM, Blessed2 said:

@Kevin This is a good one: 

 

 

Almost finished with this video. Very good so far.

[James123]

On 4/12/2024 at 12:29 AM, Kevin said:

So I tripped yesterday and like many trips my mind is blown and it feels like I wake up. and by that I don’t mean Kevin wakes up.  I mean whatever I am wakes up to itself and it’s all love and it’s only now. And there’s no doubt that it’s always now and it’s absolute love and it’s beautiful.

 

I’ve been having these trips for years and like 95% of the time when I come down and. Go to bed. I wake up the next day totally normal.

 

I guess I wish I was drowning In love and bliss and it just doesn’t seem like psychedelics are doing the trick.

Definitely not. Psychedelics are so much profound and great experiences. However, it belong to mind. And enlightenment has nothing to do with mind.