How do you know whether criticism is coming from above or below?

[Ges]

I try to keep an open mind all the time, but still. In my whole life, I've never dealt with criticism as much as the criticism I've gotten from the Actualized forum, both from members and moderators. Most people in real life just deal with me normally, and my relationships with others are good overall, at least that's how it seems to me at the moment. Even when I was at my worst (psychotic, neurotic, delusional, religious, dogmatic dickhead), rarely did anyone tell me to change my behaviors, even though I literally used to ask my friends all the time to be brutally honest with me whenever they thought I needed to change. Although, some people did reduce or even cut contact with me at the time.

And now, after getting rid of the dickhead I was before, I never get criticism anymore, literally none except from the Actualized forum, not even verbal fights or even tensions, unless of course someone steps on my boundaries, which is where I activate the chimp mode haha. But to be fair, I don't socialize as much as before so I may be wrong.

But maybe it's hard to criticize someone directly in their face, maybe the way I carry myself prevents people from thinking about criticizing me, or maybe people talk about me behind my back, but anyway. None of us is perfect. Everyone is a work-in-progress. That's how I see the world and people around me.

 

So now, how do you know if someone is actually bringing up a valid point about your behavior?

I know I know, someone is going to say there aren't any right or wrong behaviors, but let's be practical for now. Morality is relative to society, not absolutely relative, as Jordan Peterson says. And I'm not even really concerned with the moral aspect of the question. I'm mostly asking about the practical aspect. When someone tells someone else to change, what is really the case there? And why doesn't that someone change themselves instead of telling others to change? There are two sides of the equation. Either I change my behavior, or the other person accepts it as normal. So, how do we decide who should be the one to change? Can we find a middle-ground?

Edited March 27, 2022 by Ges

[Faith]

1 hour ago, Ges said:

I try to keep an open mind all the time, but still. In my whole life, I've never dealt with criticism as much as the criticism I've gotten from the Actualized forum

 

That forum can be very toxic. Not many are on their best behaviour usually, because it's an attack or be attacked atmosphere.  If the leadership isn't peaceful with good vibes, then for the most part, the members won't be either. 

 

As far as personal criticism and if it's valid my motto is "consider the source". If it's coming from someone you respect and/or like and they are being honest for your benefit (or theirs), then I'd heed the advice. If it's coming from some jackass on Actualized. Well, I wouldn't think too much about it. If it's a complete stranger when you're out and about that is criticizing you,  perhaps you were rude or something, then I'd take that on a case by case basis.

I can have a tendency to be somewhat blunt. Ppl sometimes think I'm trying to be hurtful when actually I'm not, I just don't over think it and I spit it out, "here's the problem". When actually a softer approach could be had. So, I'm working on it, but change is hard. 😊

 

 

 

 

 

[Lotus]

1 hour ago, Ges said:

So, how do we decide who should be the one to change?

My rule of thumb: if we vibe, we vibe. Makes life pretty simple.

 

1 hour ago, Ges said:

So now, how do you know if someone is actually bringing up a valid point about your behavior?

Honest and sincere reflection through the expression of thoughts and emotions can be very clarifying.

 

In order to do this, you could ask yourself these questions:

What's the content of the critique?

How do you think about it?
How do you feel about it?

Why do you think/feel that way?

[Mandy]

There's a very big difference between how open-mindedness feels when we ARE it and how just assuming everyone else is wrong (and therefore assuming that we are right) feels. If we are open-minded we can take someone else's observations about us as a gift useful in the letting go of old beliefs and stuck patterns. If we are closed minded and going off the assumption that we are bad, wrong, not intelligent or not worthy of love, we will also be accepting those criticisms but then we will be continuously trying to change and renovate ourselves to match someone's else's unexamined impossible standard. 

 

Our ideas of ourselves get in the way of the peace and happiness and knowing of our worth beyond concept. It's only from a place of great self love (or the knowing that we are not a separate self) that we can change. WHO changes, self or other, is actually irrelevant. 😵

[Phil]

 

8 hours ago, Ges said:

When someone tells someone else to change, what is really the case there?

Your beliefs, alignment & discord, and your beliefs, alignment & discord. 

8 hours ago, Ges said:

And why doesn't that someone change themselves instead of telling others to change?

🙂 Your beliefs, alignment & discord, and your beliefs, alignment & discord. 

8 hours ago, Ges said:

There are two sides of the equation. Either I change my behavior, or the other person accepts it as normal. So, how do we decide who should be the one to change? Can we find a middle-ground?

Can you find a middle a ground… with you?  

Can an equation made of middle ground be solved such that a middle ground is reached or found?

What if love, pain & suffering are common sense?

 

A practical solution given the belief in separation and thus the rarity of siddhis, might be life swapping. Like that old tv show Wife Swap, but just someone else’s life for a month. Not a tv show, just doing all their stuff.  

 

A critique, that higher than & lower than / above or below thinking can be a stickler. If I raised my kids telling them all criticism is untenable, and criticized them daily, I’d go broke from their therapy. 

[Blessed2]

14 hours ago, Ges said:

So now, how do you know if someone is actually bringing up a valid point about your behavior?

 

You kinda just feel it.

 

I believe the fundamental priority is wellbeing, at least for me it is. If something someone says to me, any advice, criticism etc. is aligned with wellbeing, you feel it. Sometimes it takes a while to open yourself up to it though. But this kind of criticism/advice is comes with respect and compassion.

 

But also you feel when someone tries to make you think of yourself guilty, unworthy, etc. When you are aligned and clear within yourself about what you want, what is your authentic self, you simply won't 'take it in'. You won't hear anyone or anything that is not aligned with your true wellbeing.

 

This flag comes go mind. I think it's the coolest flag ever, everyone should pay their respects to it. It's a bit misunderstood perhaps, and has certain negative connotations in the polarized political sphere, but I don't care, I love it. For me, it says "fuck anyone or anything that comes between me and my wellbeing." Sure, one could say it's a bit too individual-oriented or even selfish, but I don't give a shit:

 

[Ges]

@Faith @Lotus @Mandy @Phil @Blessed2 Thank you all kind people for the inputs. Appreciate your time and insightfulness.

[Faith]

@Ges Your welcome 😊

[Baller]

Yeah, you picked a bad example because actualized.org really is a toxic waste dump so you don't know whether the criticism is natural or a result of twisted groupthink formed around Leo's bizarro beliefs.

[MazE]

13 minutes ago, Baller said:

Yeah, you picked a bad example because actualized.org really is a toxic waste dump so you don't know whether the criticism is natural or a result of twisted groupthink formed around Leo's bizarro beliefs.

You can tell whether it's one or the other. It's obvious. The groupthink became unbearable. When it's groupthink criticism if you throw a match you can start a 🔥

[Baller]

1 minute ago, MazE said:

You can tell whether it's one or the other. It's obvious. The groupthink became unbearable. When it's groupthink criticism if you throw a match you can start a 🔥

It really was surreal, in the sense that you question yourself "is it possible that they really can't see through that bullshit?"  But that's what cults and quasi-cults are like.

 

But really, I think we all know our flaws, we are just too weak sometimes.

[Llurendt]

I find that information from every source I come across is worth examination and the application of discernment. Your worst enemy can be your best critic because they aren't afraid to offend you when they speak. When I am offered criticism, I try to see whether there is truth in it. I look for my behaviors and word choices which are not representative of love. In becoming aware of those, I am able to move forward more in the way that I desire to. I am careful to look at my 'pillars,' the sort of foundational ideas which I am currently operating under, and determine whether they are flawed or result in potential harm to myself or others. If what a person says causes me to find a flaw which needs addressing, then I remind myself to be grateful, regardless of how the message was conveyed to me, or by whom.

 

I do not know anything about the Actualized community (or anyone else who seems to be in the role of Antagonist), but it is beneficial to remember that They Are You. Love them as you Love yourself. Allow them to be as they are. You will find less resistance and therefore less suffering if you extend Love, forgiveness, and allowance. You might even, in your Love, act as a catalyst for them to see something differently.