Rape dreams(trigger warning)

[Jonas Long]

Just now, Reena said:

Can you be a little clear about this with example? I'm not able to follow what you are saying. Fault afterwards? 

 

Because the social pressure in your culture prohibits you from having sex, would that be a way to have sex that was beyond your control/you couldn't be held responsible.

[Phil]

@Reena

The point of scrutinizing conceptual (thought) from direct experience, is security.

Security is not found in thought or perception. 

 

The nighttime ‘dreams’ are a reoccurring reconciliation of the discrepancy between beliefs / conceptualizations, and direct experience. 

When security is no longer sought in thought & perception, the nighttime dreams no longer occur.

 

[Reena]

3 minutes ago, Jonas Long said:

Because the social pressure in your culture prohibits you from having sex, would that be a way to have sex that was beyond your control/you couldn't be held responsible.

Umm. I can actually have it if I want it. I never felt like I could never have it or feel like it's a fault if I had it. There's an element of sexual repression in me where having sex or at least imagining having sex wouldn't be easy. But I don't feel liberated in my rape dreams. Rather I feel comforted or secured / protected yet controlled very badly. It's always like a hostage situation and I'm surrendering. The surrendering feels good later because the Host seems to be telling me that I did a good job and I sympathize with him since he provides me security and survival. 

Like in the latest dream that was about 2 days ago, I was having an affair with a married man and he was kind to me and extremely sexy. When he tells me that he is not okay being with me because he has a wife, I ask him - "why can't you take care of two women?" to which he gives a nod. And in the middle of the dream, I'm taken away from him by a tall muscular man who looks like an army guy in war, like a police officer with a badge, and he looks intimidating. He takes me to his center or workplace and it looks like a dystopian fantasy where everyone is too strict and crazy like the Nazi and he tell me that he will rape me brutally and tells me that I'll love him more than the first guy. He will make me do it. He will do it through coercion. He will show me what submission means. And I'm filled with fear. And I'm scared and I ask him if he is going to be sadistic with me. And he says yes. He adds that he will be so sadistic that I'll absolutely obey him and will be forced to beg him for mercy and even show perfect obedience. And not just that. He tells me that I'll completely forget the other man and obey him and consider him my new master and that's how he is going to make me love him. I tell him that that's not possible. So he rapes me brutally. He doesn't abandon me. He makes sure that I feel safe that I'm taken care of. When some of the men try to beat me up, he protects me from them by beating them. He does this to show me that he cares about me. In the end of the dream, I'm submitting to him in a subservient way and I forget the first guy and I begin to fall in love with this man. Although I never thought I would. His control makes me do it out of pressure and I get used to it. It's like in every dream, this intimacy is forcefully extricated out of me against my will and the captor or host or rapist is the winner because he wins my love but out of coercion and force. I end up showing him love out of extreme pressure for survival  that induces Stockholm Syndrome and attachment. Like abusive love. 

 

 

 

[Someone here]

@Phil i do feel a need to apologise.  I got carried away..unnecessarily heated

And overlooked the fact that it's just a dream rape ..

Sorry .

[Someone here]

@Reena pardon my metaphysical bs questions ....

what is a dream, existentially? 

[Reena]

@Someone here I think a dream is a reflection of the subconscious. The dream is like a mirror and your subconscious is a storehouse, like an underground memory storage. 

[Someone here]

2 minutes ago, Reena said:

@Someone here I think a dream is a reflection of the subconscious. The dream is like a mirror and your subconscious is a storehouse, like an underground memory storage. 

more from a metaphysical pov .not a psychological one.

im not interested in how they are a manifestation of the  subconscious mind..

but the actual substance of the dream( if that makes sense )

what is it? where is it occurring? how is it possible? it is not obvious at all especially if you are not coming at it from the materialist paradigm .

[Phil]

18 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Phil i do feel a need to apologise.  I got carried away..unnecessarily heated

And overlooked the fact that it's just a dream rape ..

Sorry .

Appreciated and no worries my friend. 

 

It’s not even a dream. The nighttime dream is only called a dream in so far as that this is a dream is overlooked. The ‘nighttime dream’ is just a reconciliation of the discrepancy. An emptying and alignment. It’s the very reason why “we sleep” / why there is that assumption. The theme denotes the aversion. This is why ‘nighttime dreams’ are like snowflakes. That it is a reconciliation is like snow, same for all. The content or theme varies as much as the conditioning & means of aversion. Wakefulness of course never sleeps, and technically never experiences a dream in any case. (Never experiences ‘states’). 

[Reena]

15 minutes ago, Someone here said:

more from a metaphysical pov .not a psychological one.

im not interested in how they are a manifestation of the  subconscious mind..

but the actual substance of the dream( if that makes sense )

what is it? where is it occurring? how is it possible? it is not obvious at all especially if you are not coming at it from the materialist paradigm .

I'm not sure from the metaphysical perspective. 

 

[Reena]

@Jonas Long waiting for your input on my last reply. 

[Someone here]

11 minutes ago, Phil said:

Wakefulness of course never sleeps, and technically never experiences a dream in any case. (Never experiences ‘states’). 

Interesting!  Cloud you elaborate on this point ?

I'm recently been contemplating sleep and dreams too much . How is it that we lose consciousness when we sleep ? And how exactly are we resurrected  every morning?  Like how is it like an On/Off switch ?

[Someone here]

2 minutes ago, Reena said:

I'm not sure from the metaphysical perspective. 

 

OK. 

Are you interested in discussing this metaphysical aspect or not ?

[Reena]

Just now, Someone here said:

OK. 

Are you interested in discussing this metaphysical aspect or not ?

Yea would love to hear what others have to say about it. 

[Reena]

My dreams were a manifesting of what I had been through. Why did I find comfort in them? 

Because that was the only way to find closure with the cruelty of the situation! 

 

If it did not end well in real life, it at least ended well in my dreams.. 

 

[Phil]

@Someone here

Sure. Metaphysics / metaphysical is actually a means of mental & emotional manipulation. Manipulation is a means of aversion. 

 

Feel free to make a thread about it as not to hijack or derail this one. 🙂

 

[Jonas Long]

11 minutes ago, Reena said:

@Jonas Long waiting for your input on my last reply. 

Yeah dunno.

[Reena]

23 minutes ago, Reena said:

My dreams were a manifesting of what I had been through. Why did I find comfort in them? 

Because that was the only way to find closure with the cruelty of the situation! 

 

If it did not end well in real life, it at least ended well in my dreams.. 

 

I think it was a way to have closure and peace with the abuse I went through. I liken it to something like this. 

Imagine being bullied in high school by some terrible person who tortures you, pours gasoline on you. Makes you suffer. You suffer trauma as a result. Of course the memory is painful. 

Years later when you are all grown up, you get dreams, really bad dreams. In these dreams you're being raped. Man or woman doesn't matter whoever you are. 

The person who is raping you is the same person who poured gasoline on you in high school. Now they are grown up too. But in the dream they torture you  and rape you again. You surrender to this power. Although you escaped them in real life and were terrified of them. But in the dream, you build a sado masochistic relationship with them. You surrender to their power and authority. This sado masochistic relationship helps you heal the trauma you went through with them and because of them. Since you could not find justice and peace with them for what they did, your way to find closure was through these means. In hard core reality you couldn't have expected justice. Yet in the dream world this is possible although not in the perfect way, not in the way you would want it. What's not possible in real life is happening in the dream. They wanted you to submit but you didn't want to. They didn't want to give you closure in real life yet they have to do so in the dream. The karmas of both meet at a perfect point. The manifestation through rape. 

At the end of the brutal act you submit. It's not justice, yet it's closure. They taking care of you or providing you security or survival is probably out of guilt of having tortured you. You submitting to their rape is symbolic of you validating their power and sadistic intent thus satisfying their bloodlust and giving them the closure they needed out of you long time ago during the first encounter. This is not justice, but this is karmic closure. The reality was extremely brutal and takes you to  the time when bad things happened between you and that person in high school. Yet through the rape, both are able to forgive one another and satisfy each other in half baked ways like a dystopian fantasy. You find comfort in the rapist because they let you feel safe although this wasn't the reality. It's not a happy ending but it's not as brutal as what happened in real life and it's your brain's mechanism to cope with what happened and give it to proper ending in your dreams so your suffering and current trauma  finds subconscious healing through the dream. A sort of reconciliation of what happened without letting your tormentor make it much worse for you and burying the memory of what happened and replacing it with a rape dream thus sealing the wound and not letting it  fester any further. 

This seems like a powerful interpretation given that I'm a child abuse victim and the dream could be significant in trying to heal me. 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Reena

[Someone here]

@Phil 👍 ok

[Reena]

5 minutes ago, Reena said:

I think it was a way to have closure and peace with the abuse I went through. I liken it to something like this. 

Imagine being bullied in high school by some terrible person who tortures you, pours gasoline on you. Makes you suffer. You suffer trauma as a result. Of course the memory is painful. 

Years later when you are all grown up, you get dreams, really bad dreams. In these dreams you're being raped. Man or woman doesn't matter whoever you are. 

The person who is raping you is the same person who poured gasoline on you in high school. Now they are grown up too. But in the dream they torture you  and rape you again. You surrender to this power. Although you escaped them in real life and were terrified of them. But in the dream, you build a sado masochistic relationship with them. You surrender to their power and authority. This sado masochistic relationship helps you heal the trauma you went through with them and because of them. Since you could not find justice and peace with them for what they did, your way to find closure was through these means. In hard core reality you couldn't have expected justice. Yet in the dream world this is possible although not in the perfect way, not in the way you would want it. What's not possible in real life is happening in the dream. They wanted you to submit but you didn't want to. They didn't want to give you closure in real life yet they have to do so in the dream. The karmas of both meet at a perfect point. The manifestation through rape. 

At the end of the brutal act you submit. It's not justice, yet it's closure. They taking care of you or providing you security or survival is probably out of guilt of having tortured you. You submitting to their rape is symbolic of you validating their power and sadistic intent thus satisfying their bloodlust and giving them the closure they needed out of you long time ago during the first encounter. This is not justice, but this is karmic closure. The reality was extremely brutal and takes you to  the time when bad things happened between you and that person in high school. Yet through the rape, both are able to forgive one another and satisfy each other in half baked ways like a dystopian fantasy. You find comfort in the rapist because they let you feel safe although this wasn't the reality. It's not a happy ending but it's not as brutal as what happened in real life and it's your brain's mechanism to cope with what happened and give it to proper ending in your dreams so your suffering and current trauma  finds subconscious healing through the dream. A sort of reconciliation of what happened without letting your tormentor make it much worse for you and burying the memory of what happened and replacing it with a rape dream thus sealing the wound and not letting it  fester any further. 

This seems like a powerful interpretation given that I'm a child abuse victim and the dream could be significant in trying to heal me. 

 

I think I can call this some kind of a karmic cleansing act. And it makes a lot of sense why I was getting such a dream repeatedly. Now I realize that it was some sort of a karmic cleansing going on. 

 

The rapist was my tormentor in real life or past life. Through raping me he was karmic cleansing himself. 

 

I was karmic cleansing by submitting to him. 

Both were cleansing each other's karma. 

My karma was my trauma. His karma was his guilt. 

 

[Phil]

@Reena

Karma is always a ‘table for one’, just like suffering. Inseparable.