Vipassana Retreat Tips

[Eothasian]

35 minutes ago, Celestial said:

@Eothasian The basic idea is that when you normally encounter situations that you are averse to, eg. Someone saying something that you interpret as abusive, the mind unconsciously reacts and there will be corresponding sensations that arise on/in the body. You are told to feel the sensations on the body objectively, with equanimity. This is said to purify the minds old habit patterns of aversion and craving. (sankharas).

 

The area you start with is actually larger than the tip of the nose, it's the whole nose and nostril area, including the area below the nostrils and above the upper lip. Basically regular breath awareness meditation. There is also a lot of time during the day where you're not actually sitting down and meditating. 

 

As far as not feeling angry and drained, I'm not too sure. Obviously it's not a walk in the park, but everyone will have a different experience. Sometimes I was feeling great and other times I was feeling just meh.

😊

[James123]

On 7/30/2022 at 5:28 AM, Celestial said:

Hey guys,
I will be attending a 10 day Vipassana meditation retreat in about a week. This is the first one that I will be attending.

I was just wondering if you guys have any tips for the retreat or any reports on any retreats that you've attended. I'm not gonna lie, I'm a little bit intimidated and nervous but also excited and interested.

Thanks 🙂

Try to stay in darkness and silence. 

[Aware Wolf]

6 hours ago, Eothasian said:

Sounds interesting.

 

"The technique includes a strict focussing on the tip of the nose for the first three days. "

How do you sit through that without getting angry and feeling drained?

 

Stuff will come up. Goenka is intense. Whatever comes up, is something to look at. Anger might be more interesting to look at than the breath.. Goenka people, like Christopher Titmuss writes in the article linked above, may say it's one's sankhara's bubbling to the surface. So it's good to deal with it, they say. That's one reason that at some centers, they refuse people option to move to a chair. If you're new to meditation, and say on day 4 after 8-12 hour days of sitting are having leg issues and pain --- well, that's your sankhara's coming up, they say. Your life will have pain too. So it's good to face it here. Moving to a chair is an escape and doesn't deal with your root sankharas, they say. 

 

It's a POV. I don't agree with it. Many vipassana retreats non-Goenka a chair is always available as an option.Looking at pain and suffering I believe is rather an advanced meditation. People will hate meditaton if they have a lot of pain and suffering doing it. 90% of Goenka participants never return to another retreat. Although I think looking at pain is valid technique, I suggest starting out at 5 minutes. Then go have some tea or play with the cat. As someone with leg issues -- I think barring people from using a chair when they need it -- is ridiculous and I'm surprised that they've not been sued in the US by someone who gets a DVT or something. I think pain and suffering comes into one's life enough that we don't need to go looking and seeking it out by not letting people sit in a chair. It's just silly. 

 

Which is why I was a bit surprised to see Celestial's Dream Board with nice words about doing a meditation retreat. Vipassana retreats are many things, and I try to dissuade people from expecting peace and bliss coming from attending one. For many, they are a hard slog. Some people might find the shock and stress of 8-12 hour day sitting a rude awakening (no pun intended). 

 

I have done many Mahasi sayadaw style vipassana retreats. Mahasi is intense too, but at the center I was at, the individual yogi made it so. We set our own schedules. Some beginners sat for 20 minutes sitting, then 20 minutes walking, then repeat.

 

In my corner of the meditation hall, I had a chair available, if needed, but also a pile of cushions. I would sit for a long time, sometimes hours. But sometimes I used a chair too. I also did a ton of walking meditation. In the hot afternoons, after a nap, I would do lying meditation on the cool concrete in my room. I also did standing meditation. When I have friends who go to this center, I recommend slow walks around the compound and doing Metta meditation. Metta meditation helps keep one grounded and I think helps with a vipassana disconnect where sometimes people walk around ultra slow like vipassana zombie. I had my own private cabin and so I could do morning stretching (yoga) and also light stretching during the day. I think my longest retreat here was around 75 days. With being there 75 days it's certain you'll have some bad days. Just do more walking meditation, Metta, and lying meditation. Relax, it'll pass. Sometimes I think yogis think they cannot decrease their sitting mat time or they'll lose whatever progress they've made. Me, on the other hand, i don't think there's anything wrong with walking meditation. Some monks all they do is walking meditation. I don't think sitting in lotus or half lotus or burmese style is anything special. It's not holy. It's the mind that's the issue, not the body. I say that if Buddha was born today, he'd be meditating in a chair. 

 

I often post that something is a point of view. Here too I think it's important to realize that Goenka's is a POV. One of many POVs about vipassana. I've attended Christopher TItmuss's vipassana retreats and while they're not easy, they're not the slog Goenka is. With Goenka, I was counting the days until it was over. With Christopher's I enjoy it, mostly, and it seem fun. Or as fun as a vipassana retreat can be. With Goenka, the schedule is mostly just sitting. WIth Christopher and other vipassana teachers, there might be: yoga, daily instructions, karma yoga daily chores, group interviews, personal interviews (optional), dharma talk, dharma inquiry -- along with sitting meditation and walking meditation. One meets other people and makes friends. It's a good sangha. Sometimes I save up difficult questions I have for a Christopher personal interview. He's been helpful for me. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Eothasian]

12 minutes ago, Aware Wolf said:

 

Stuff will come up. Goenka is intense. Whatever comes up, is something to look at. Anger might be more interesting to look at than the breath.. Goenka people, like Christopher Titmuss writes in the article linked above, may say it's one's sankhara's bubbling to the surface. So it's good to deal with it, they say. That's one reason that at some centers, they refuse people option to move to a chair. If you're new to meditation, and say on day 4 after 8-12 hour days of sitting are having leg issues and pain --- well, that's your sankhara's coming up, they say. Your life will have pain too. So it's good to face it here. Moving to a chair is an escape and doesn't deal with your root sankharas, they say. 

 

It's a POV. I don't agree with it. Many vipassana retreats non-Goenka a chair is always available as an option.Looking at pain and suffering I believe is rather an advanced meditation. People will hate meditaton if they have a lot of pain and suffering doing it. 90% of Goenka participants never return to another retreat. Although I think looking at pain is valid technique, I suggest starting out at 5 minutes. Then go have some tea or play with the cat. As someone with leg issues -- I think barring people from using a chair when they need it -- is ridiculous and I'm surprised that they've not been sued in the US by someone who gets a DVT or something. I think pain and suffering comes into one's life enough that we don't need to go looking and seeking it out by not letting people sit in a chair. It's just silly. 

 

Which is why I was a bit surprised to see Celestial's Dream Board with nice words about doing a meditation retreat. Vipassana retreats are many things, and I try to dissuade people from expecting peace and bliss coming from attending one. For many, they are a hard slog. Some people might find the shock and stress of 8-12 hour day sitting a rude awakening (no pun intended). 

 

I have done many Mahasi sayadaw style vipassana retreats. Mahasi is intense too, but at the center I was at, the individual yogi made it so. We set our own schedules. Some beginners sat for 20 minutes sitting, then 20 minutes walking, then repeat.

 

In my corner of the meditation hall, I had a chair available, if needed, but also a pile of cushions. I would sit for a long time, sometimes hours. But sometimes I used a chair too. I also did a ton of walking meditation. In the hot afternoons, after a nap, I would do lying meditation on the cool concrete in my room. I also did standing meditation. When I have friends who go to this center, I recommend slow walks around the compound and doing Metta meditation. Metta meditation helps keep one grounded and I think helps with a vipassana disconnect where sometimes people walk around ultra slow like vipassana zombie. I had my own private cabin and so I could do morning stretching (yoga) and also light stretching during the day. I think my longest retreat here was around 75 days. With being there 75 days it's certain you'll have some bad days. Just do more walking meditation, Metta, and lying meditation. Relax, it'll pass. Sometimes I think yogis think they cannot decrease their sitting mat time or they'll lose whatever progress they've made. Me, on the other hand, i don't think there's anything wrong with walking meditation. Some monks all they do is walking meditation. I don't think sitting in lotus or half lotus or burmese style is anything special. It's not holy. It's the mind that's the issue, not the body. I say that if Buddha was born today, he'd be meditating in a chair. 

 

I often post that something is a point of view. Here too I think it's important to realize that Goenka's is a POV. One of many POVs about vipassana. I've attended Christopher TItmuss's vipassana retreats and while they're not easy, they're not the slog Goenka is. With Goenka, I was counting the days until it was over. With Christopher's I enjoy it, mostly, and it seem fun. Or as fun as a vipassana retreat can be. With Goenka, the schedule is mostly just sitting. WIth Christopher and other vipassana teachers, there might be: yoga, daily instructions, karma yoga daily chores, group interviews, personal interviews (optional), dharma talk, dharma inquiry -- along with sitting meditation and walking meditation. One meets other people and makes friends. It's a good sangha. Sometimes I save up difficult questions I have for a Christopher personal interview. He's been helpful for me. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hm, okay. Interesting.

 

I couldn't do it, too. I got a twisted vertebrae issue, so yeah. 

 

I said it before, but I like your style.

[Celestial]

@Aware Wolf 75 day retreat is insane!! 😁

I couldn't fathom even doing a 20 day retreat after completing the 10 days.

I found this pretty intriguing: 

 

[Aware Wolf]

@Celestial You could do longer vipassana retreats.

 

I remember when I told my friend that I'd done two 10-day back to back Christopher Titmuss vipassana retreats. She was into Goenka. She said I was an "iron man". This statement puzzled me. I'm a slow starter and doing twenty days with Christopher was fine, even good, and not *that* difficult. 

 

I also watched "Dhamma Brothers" a documentary on teaching Goenka vipassana at an Alabama prison. One of the inmates said it was the most difficult thing he'd ever done in his life. I was again puzzled by this. The vipassana retreats I'd done with Christopher and with a Mahasi center wouldn't be in my top ten, maybe top twenty difficult experiences. Christopher's retreats are kinda fun.

 

Eventually I learned about the structure of Goenka, mandatory group sits. i attended a Goenka retreat. I half joked that I wanted to experience it myself so I could talk smack about them. I had a chair that I requested before hand. The people there were nice. The method of sweeping is a good one. Still on day 2, there was a 2 hour sit. Crazy.  The only other western guy in my dorm left on day 3. 

 

Once at a cafe, someone told me that they *hated* vipassana. I like vipassana. I inquired as to why. She told me the pain she had doing a Goenka retreat and how it was torture. I told her what she hated was Goenka -- not vipassana. if she'd done a Christopher Titmuss vipassana retreat it would be a completely different experience. Christopher tells new people that just flew in, that if they're really feeling tired, jet lag, -- they had his permission to start their day with breakfast and they can sleep a little later. 

 

Even Mahasi which I like a lot and is strict and intense -- yogis put it all on ourselves. But everyone is working hard and one can get into a habit. But you could shorten your sits, use a chair, do more walking meditation, or just lie on your bed in your cabin and meditate. It's up to you. THis type of structure is more conducive to longer retreats. At a Mahasi vipassana center, you can setup your own schedule. I think doing all four postures of meditation is a good one along with including Metta meditation. 

 

Most retreats if you don't show up for a sit, no one really cares that much. Whereas Goenka, they will come and get you. To be honest, although I believe I'm a good yogi. I often volunteer and help setup Chistopher's retreat for example, I am always up earliest and doing the early morning yoga sessions. I have a habit of missing the last evening scheduled meditation sits. Usually it's cold and dark. I enjoy being back at my bed with my warm sleeping bag, perhaps reading a bit of inspirational dharma or suttas before falling asleep. doing 90% of the schedule is fine with me. Although evidently it's not just me as Christopher complains that in the last sit, the meditation hall is sometimes only half full. 

 

@Celestialdo you have plans for another vipassana retreat ? 

 

 

[Celestial]

@Aware Wolf I definitely want to do more retreats, I think I will do Goenka again, but now that I've heard different perspectives, I'd also like to try something else in the future. 

 

It would be cool to have someone like Christopher give a Dharma talk in person. Although, one of the guys there had done 11 courses and he said that every time he attends, there's always more things that he picks up during the evening discourses. It seems like all the assistant teachers can do at Goenka is to help with the technique. 

 

That sounds like a cool documentary 😄

[Celestial]

@Phil Just had a few question about solo retreats. 

How long were you typically on retreat for? 

Were they "meditation retreats" or just "alone time" retreats? 

 

Solo retreats sound like a wonderful thing that I'd like to experience, but I could not imagine meditating 10 hours a day like it is at a Goenka retreat.

I was thinking, even just 10 days in silence and being with oneself would be powerful.

[Phil]

@Celestial

🙂

The solo’s started out as weekends camping in a tent in the woods, bringing necessities, cooking by fire, etc. Upgraded to one room shelter cabins basically, w/o elec & plumbing, then to decent cabins with elec & water. Did maybe 2 or 3 a year of 2-3 days, and about once a year of 7 - 10 days. They were meditation / truth seeking retreats. Pretty textbook. Around 6 hrs meditation a day, eating only natural foods, taking mushrooms in the evening, playing guitar, singing, contemplating, writing. In hindsight I guess the theme was basically being alone in nature, purifying, expressing, ‘expanding the mind’ & generally emptying out. That was a few years, then moved on to nicer cabins and more of just ‘alone time retreats’. 20, 40 or 60 mins of morning meditation.

 

Roughing it seeking / finding out the Truth for a few years… and then getting away from all the busyness to bask in Truth a bit more comfortably in the later years / retreats kind of sums it up. 

 

Just for some ‘color’… I didn’t start retreats until around 33, so I’d already been working full time for 20 years and “did ok for myself” lol by that point. So the roughing it with only bare essentials in the woods was very intentional & impactful in terms of attachment & appreciation. 

 

*Pro tips if you ‘rough it’ - bring mosquito spray / don’t meditate for hours ignoring them & end up with a hundred welts. Bring an inflatable sleeping bag or mattress. Put rocks in the fire and bury them in the ground under the tent / sleeping bag so you don’t wake up freezing in the middle of the night. Bring more than enough water. Don’t walk into the woods without a compass / map or markers. Check the weather so you don’t have literally everything you brought including the tent & all your clothes ripped away in a wind storm… and never retreat from the retreat no matter what. (Sans anything life threatening or whatever). 

 

Every retreat was wonderful though. I’d do it all again. 

[Celestial]

@Phil Thank you 

That sounds like an amazing experience. Freedom to do whatever ya fkn want haha.

Also, mushrooms to top it off 👌

41 minutes ago, Phil said:

 

Check the weather so you don’t have literally everything you brought including the tent & all your clothes ripped away in a wind storm… 

Oddly specific 😆

 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Celestial