About meditation

[Blessed2]

I've been using the basic meditation/relaxation technique lately and have noticed something peculiar.

 

Basically, if I simply bring awareness to the muscle area and repeat "relax" or "let go", the meditation session feels more uncomfortable, the muslces don't relax as easily (there isn't that wonderful very subtle feeling of letting go) and the session feels longer.

 

If I do the same thing, but focus on the muscle are & see it as an object within 'background awareness', and repeat something like "in the right-nowness of awareness, this area is an object without independent existence", there is more easily that subtle relaxation and letting go. The session feels more enjoyable and time flies more swiftly. (I don't repeat those words as a mantra, but they more like kinda just appear / remind to bring the focus to the actuality of the background awareness and the actuality of the sensation of the muscle area.)

 

Why is that?

 

Is the feeling of enjoyment and time going by more swiftly a good sign, as in keep doing it that way?

 

Edited February 23 by Blessed2

[Phil]

40 minutes ago, Blessed2 said:

Why is that?

In the bigger picture, subtle discordant aspects of interpretations were felt, yet unnoticed. Now ‘they’ are being felt, noticed, and questioned. 

 

40 minutes ago, Blessed2 said:

Basically, if I simply bring awareness to the muscle area and repeat "relax" or "let go", the meditation session feels more uncomfortable, the muslces don't relax as easily (there isn't that wonderful very subtle feeling of letting go) and the session feels longer.

The preface is ‘I bring awareness’. It’s subtly discordant & tense as opposed to relaxing, because of the implied separate self (which brings awareness). This is one of those incidents where it’s easy to chalk the subtly up to semantics, but it’s not the meditation session which feels uncomfortable, as a meditation session doesn’t feel or have a feel to it. The discord is only of the interpretation as it relates to awareness, or, how the thought feels to, awareness. Then, as in next (imo) there is the thought that this is related to meditation. 

 

Does a session feel longer, or does the separate self of thought come with thoughts about time? The sep self is notorious for never being present. Again, could be interpreted as semantical, but these are the subtleties being discovered. 

 

41 minutes ago, Blessed2 said:

If I do the same thing, but focus on the muscle are & see it as an object within 'background awareness', and repeat something like "in the right-nowness of awareness, this area is an object without independent existence", there is more easily that subtle relaxation and letting go. The session feels more enjoyable and time flies more swiftly. (I don't repeat those words as a mantra, but they more like kinda just appear / remind to bring the focus to the actuality of the background awareness and the actuality of the sensation of the muscle area.)

That isn’t quite the same, as in, the interpretation is very different. Technically, the difference is interpretation added, compared to no interpretation added. ‘I focus on’ is aligned, accurate, true of awareness (not an interpretation of). Aligned, is naturally relaxed, peaceful. 

 

Even Jesus didn’t say ‘I’m the bringer of awareness’. 🙂 (Comic relief. Also subtle, yet relief nonetheless.)

 

1 hour ago, Blessed2 said:

Is the feeling of enjoyment and time going by more swiftly a good sign, as in keep doing it that way?

If I said no, the feeling of enjoyment is an indication that you should not keep doing it that way, would you listen?

[Ceejay]

As a practitioner of self inquiry who does not employ mindfulness techniques (in a wilful manner), there is a point in what Phil said above.

 

I don't make it a point to focus on a muscle that is tense and say anything. My focus during meditation is what the "I" is doing/thinking. Where is this "I"? Or simply giving the subtle "letting go" suggestion to all thoughts (word/image formations) appearing in awareness.

 

The vipassana technique of focusing on a specific body part intentionally, and wilfully, has embedded in it the notion of a "doer"/"meditator"/"focus-er". Self inquiry or dissolving into thoughtlessness/wordlessness by simply dismissing all thought formations, does not retain a doer. If you are unfamiliar with self-inquiry, then there might be a temporary sense of an inquirer, but as practice proceeds, this notion of an inquirer is also deconstructed (which does not happen with vipassana).

Edited February 23 by Ceejay

[Blessed2]

9 hours ago, Phil said:

Technically, the difference is interpretation added, compared to no interpretation added.

 

That's what I've been wondering though... Cause it seems like "I bring awareness to muscle area and repeat relax" is less interpretation / avtivity of thought... Whereas "background consciousness, object without independent existence" is more interpretation / activity thought. Kind of how God, or observer is conceptualization. It puzzles me how the latter which seems to be more activity of thought is more relaxing and feels better.

 

The "puzzling subject matter" is similar to how the quiet mantra meditation vs. focus on breath feels. Even though the quiet mantra is activity of thought, it feels better than focus on breathing.

 

9 hours ago, Phil said:

If I said no, the feeling of enjoyment is an indication that you should not keep doing it that way, would you listen?

 

This is quite telling I guess, but honestly, I probably would listen to you, at least to some extend. 😂😬

 

Maybe that's kind of where the puzzlement is really at. Where any puzzlement ever really is at.

 

[Blessed2]

1 hour ago, Ceejay said:

As a practitioner of self inquiry who does not employ mindfulness techniques (in a wilful manner), there is a point in what Phil said above.

 

I don't make it a point to focus on a muscle that is tense and say anything. My focus during meditation is what the "I" is doing/thinking. Where is this "I"? Or simply giving the subtle "letting go" suggestion to all thoughts (word/image formations) appearing in awareness.

 

The vipassana technique of focusing on a specific body part intentionally, and wilfully, has embedded in it the notion of a "doer"/"meditator"/"focus-er". Self inquiry or dissolving into thoughtlessness/wordlessness by simply dismissing all thought formations, does not retain a doer. If you are unfamiliar with self-inquiry, then there might be a temporary sense of an inquirer, but as practice proceeds, this notion of an inquirer is also deconstructed (which does not happen with vipassana).

 

I'm familiar with self-inquiry, and have experimented with it a bit.

 

Something just seems to be 'pushing' me toward the basic relaxation meditation. Like for example, I may have a plan to do self-inquiry tomorrow. But when I sit down to meditate, I always do the basic relaxation technique instead. 😂

 

1 hour ago, Ceejay said:

this notion of an inquirer is also deconstructed (which does not happen with vipassana).

 

That's the thing. That's kind of what's "pushing" me toward basic relaxation over and over. Cause thoughts/beliefs like that are more or less subtly discordant, and they're what's being let go. 🤔

 

[Phil]

1 hour ago, Blessed2 said:

That's what I've been wondering though... Cause it seems like "I bring awareness to muscle area and repeat relax" is less interpretation / avtivity of thought... Whereas "background consciousness, object without independent existence" is more interpretation / activity thought. Kind of how God, or observer is conceptualization. It puzzles me how the latter which seems to be more activity of thought is more relaxing and feels better.

More or less isn’t significant, as it’s interpretation. (More interpretation is an interpretation, less interpretation is an interpretation). That any of this is actually about meditation is activity of thought, interpretation, and not true. 

 

The second resonates comparatively because it’s without the implied separate self. Neither resonates meditatively, as neither is gently returning attention to the feeling of breathing in the stomach, and both are attention on thought. 

 

 

[Ceejay]

6 hours ago, Blessed2 said:

Cause thoughts/beliefs like that are more or less subtly discordant

 

In that case, follow your calling. Maybe self-inquiry is not for you. Reading Jean Klien's work was/is helpful for me.