Interesting Dream I Once Had

[Orb]

One night I dreamed I was being attacked by people. 

 

I responded with love and said nice things to them, they mocked me and started to hit me. The whole experience was very visceral and there was definitely an adrenaline spike, yet I maintained my composure as much as I could and just stayed attentive and loving. 

 

I realized I was gonna die as they were attacking me and that was really intense.

 

Any interesting lessons you guys wanna reflect off of this dream? 

 

It was one of this deeply hitting dreams. 

Edited September 13, 2022 by Orb

[Eothasian]

i guess that's a more explicit representation of how some people are aligned towards innocence

 

and you're processing what you experienced to handle it better

 

Edited September 13, 2022 by Eothasian

[Phil]

Just 2 cents, hopefully some insight…

 

This dream strikes me as quite deep, structural oriented (vs content of experience oriented), and as an unresolved discrepancy playing out in the psyche, that I’ll form as questions for the sake of communication. Because the unresolved discrepancy involves the apparent world and the true nature of our being, or life & death, the discrepancy ‘itself’ (the perspective) must so to speak leave the finite mind when transition from the apparent waking state to the apparent dream state occurs. (When you go to sleep. Imo the dream content really goes straight to the core question of why is there evil in the world. Put another way, if all there is is our infinite being which is love, why is there violence? Put yet another way… how can it be that horrific atrocities & injustices occur when all are, when all there actually is, is pure innocence / our infinite being? 

 

In short, for infinite to experience, infinite must be the experience because infinite is, infinite. For infinite to experience there must be somewhere experience seems to transpire, so infinite being be’s somewhere. 

 

Yet for infinite being even this somewhere would not be enough to constitute experience, as infinite being is self-aware / self-knowing, aware & knowing that it is, infinite. So at this point what we might call experience, albeit apparent / an appearance of our infinite being… for infinite being, there would not be experience (yet), because infinite being knows that it is appearing as somewhere (aka, creation, the universe, the world). Where as we might find an experience of a world, infinite being would still be knowing only of itself. 

 

For infinite being to seem to know of experience (creation, the universe, the world)… infinite being must veil itself of the knowing of it’s own infinitude. In one sense this is sacrificial, and yet in another sense it is not because while infinite being forgets it’s infinitude, it never actually be’s anything other than infinite being. So infinite being be’s the lens or finite mind through which a world can be known. 

 

This is the same as when a finite nighttime dream is experienced. For the dream to occur and be experienced, it must very much seem like there is somewhere and someone experiencing the somewhere. 

 

So in short the ‘why’ of why is there violence, or why is there evil, is ultimately that there isn’t, there is just ignorance. Ignorance seems to imply cognitive or knowledge, as if there were information that could or should be known but isn’t. In rephrasing that to ignore-ance, imo it’s clearer in the sense it points to feeling being ignored. 

 

But then the question probably arises, how is it that there are people who legitimately seem to feel better from enacting violence? That brings us to the separate self being only the activity of thought, or essentially an idea. It is actually possible for one to experience feeling better about themself (about the idea) from enacting harm or violence. Feeling better about “themself” can feel better than the depth of suffering they’re experiencing that is the actual discord between the idea of themself and the unconditional love they actually are. It is like a false feeling of empowerment as a respite from the typically experienced suffering of identified with or as powerlessness. 

 

 

I know you’re asking about a dream interpretation, but just to mention, practically speaking defending the body from attack is imo intelligence / the intelligent thing to do, as opposed to meeting such an experience with lovingkindness. 

[Orb]

@Phil yea, I could've just flown away, but I was like let's see what happens and it didn't go as planned!

 

Motherfuckers tried to kill me! 🤬

[Mandy]

26 minutes ago, Phil said:

But then the question probably arises, how is it that there are people who legitimately seem to feel better from enacting violence? That brings us to the separate self being only the activity of thought, or essentially an idea. It is actually possible for one to experience feeling better about themself (about the idea) from enacting harm or violence. Feeling better about “themself” can feel better than the depth of suffering they’re experiencing that is the actual discord between the idea of themself and the unconditional love they actually are. It is like a false feeling of empowerment as a respite from the typically experienced suffering of identified with or as powerlessness. 

What about the inverse of this, self harm? Is self harm a form of revenge? 

[Phil]

@Mandy

It’s essentially an other-than discordant thoughts / suffering coping mechanism, without recognizing the discord or suffering is indicative of the thoughts. If one were not ‘firmly’ ‘in time’, it wouldn’t be possible to self harm. Like anything else, there are varying degrees experienced based on varying degrees of interpretation, internalization & identification, like; it happened, vs it happened to me, vs it happened to me and it’s my fault (shame), vs it isn’t only something that happened to me but is who I am or is indicative of who I am (shame + identifying), vs limits or determines who I am & will be (shame + identifying + will impact future = greatest intensity).

 

One could be re-creating shame related to a past event, reacting intensely to a current event, or worrying profusely about a future event. As a thought & feeling relationship reference, in any case if that one got kissed or stung by a wasp, one is nonetheless ‘more present’ / attention has withdrawn from the activity of thought, and therein there is a reprieve of suffering. Even though there is the trade off for the localized pain, there is a break from the ‘same old’, much more intense suffering.

 

I’d agree it could be revenge, yes. The desire for a parent, abuser, or even someone one strongly dislikes or disagrees with to have to see the pain one is in. That might still nonetheless have an underlying impulsivity (vs intention) to feel, be in control, and or be in control of feeling in terms of what’s happening with one’s body. 

 

I find shame to be like a secret that is very difficult to live with and varies in intensity, and due to the internalization nature of shame it’s very difficult to express & dispel, and so it could also be a physical visual (vs audible) expression of asking for help. As you well know though, in all cases the chief desire is actually to feel better, counterintuitive as it might be experienced as. 

 

Brings to mind the many ‘forms’ of self sabotage paradoxically aimed at feeling better. 

 

 

 

[Mandy]

4 hours ago, Phil said:

Brings to mind the many ‘forms’ of self sabotage paradoxically aimed at feeling better. 

 

👍 Also the victim/abuser thing. It's weird though, after hearing a bunch of Mr. Ballen stories like the ones where the guy pretends to be super successful and to have this amazing job, but in reality flunked out of school years ago and hides it, then when it gets to a point where he can't keep up the charade anymore, just decides to murder his family. It's like in avoidance of feeling the emotions of insecurity, guilt, unworthiness, hatred and rage are acted out. But these are NOT actual expression of hatred or rage at all but actually, total repression of unworthiness or powerlessness. So it would be much better for them to actually sink down the worst feeling emotions rather than trying to stay above them... the scale is in a way, circular? Like powerlessness in transmutation/removing a self, magically *poofs* into total surrender, which is also total empowerment?

[Mandy]

@Orb How did the dream feel, were you terrorized or at peace? 

[Phil]

@Mandy

Yeah, like how jealousy is kind of opposite to positive expectation. 

[Orb]

@Mandy there was adrenaline pumping, but outside I was calm, like body wasn't shaking or anything like that. 

[Mandy]

@Phil So now I'm wondering what would happen if you consciously used the scale to feel better, but used it backwards? 🤔 What if you CAN get there from here? 😂

 

@Orb I once had a dream where this teenage kid came at me with a knife and I just had this knowing, and I held my ground and held my arms open, and he dropped the knife, embraced me and started sobbing. The feeling that came with it was wonderful and it was a dream that stuck with me. At the time my mom was working as a teacher's aid, and was in charge of a teenage kid who was troubled and should not have been in public school and she was scared and not dealing with it well. I think dreams can have a message for us without us needing to know exactly what it is, because the message evolves with us. 

[Loop]

@Mandy

 

 I feel the scale can be used backwards once the Light has been revealed, this is what I usually refer to as the 9th chakra, 2 above the crown. The Light just drops straight back down to earth, it is like finding the tiniest speck of yin energy deep within the high amount yang energy that is found in the higher chakras. 
 

When the shame, guilt, and fear, has been illuminated by awareness you can find the speck of yang energy in the high amount of yin energy of the lower chakras, the spark of the fire. 
 

Flaming passion,

And cool compassion.  
 

Like cranialsacral therapy. 
The more the head and the sacrum synchronize properly,

The more the heart can Be,

Without discord from above or below,

Left and right come to centre.
 

Body awareness practices that eventually swallow your entire being into this ineffable dance. 
 

Basically you can go in reverse if you have trained enough to remain as Awareness, 

Gotten to the point where Meditation isn’t something you do, 

You just Be.

 

Just my 2 cents. 🤍
 

 

[Phil]

@Mandy

It’s like a Reality / where I’m at check lol. It’s either gonna get low vibe or funny real quick. 

 

 

[Loop]

@Phil

 

Exactly 😆

That is wonderful,

Boundless Awareness. 
 

I think it can be really important to go down the scale in reverse, I do it in a cycle going up and back down, or down and back up. It is like using the joy you uncover to uncover more joy, Love just silently watches this wonderful healing.
 

Consciously feeling worse to be able to ‘ride the waves’ when an emotion arises ‘in the wild’ and return back to Being.
  

[Orb]

@Loop

 

Just now, Loop said:

 

I think it can be really important to go down the scale in reverse

 

I'm really good at this.

[Loop]

@Orb

 

Done as awareness? Or unconsciously? 😄

 

[Orb]

@Loop unconsciously 😌

[Loop]

@Orb

 

Well then, what is that which is aware of it being done unconsciously 🥰

 

[Orb]

@Loop leo gura

[Loop]

@Orb

 

🧐 You find another one in you? How could that be? 😂