The Pain

[Agape]

Stuffy stuff

[Agape]

Eckhart Tolle calls it the 'Pain Body'. For me, 'The Pain' is a term that makes sense of everything. I've been advised not to overthink, not overanalyze, not do analytical jobs, to accept things, to be more compassionate and kind towards myself, to rationalize, to recontextualize, to relive memories, to understand my'self' and express my feelings. All of that kicked the can down the road. It's good for moderation. To not go too far and fast too quickly. The only thing that has helped me is to sit with emotions and not tense up. 

 

I look at what is going on in Western Europe and it scares the shit out of me. But there's fuck all I can do about it. I see beautiful women and...anyways everything, just everything. I have no first hand knowledge of why there is consciousness, why we are here, if there were past lives, if there will be life after death, if there is a God...and so on. 

 

But there is the pain. It's here. Everybody's got it. Rich people don't care about poor people. Poor people don't care about rich people and every other in-group out-group division is in that dynamic. But everybody's got the pain. So what to do about it? Other people find their way it seems. And I believed so many paths would work so many times. Over a number of years I would periodically go back to mindfulness of emotions for a week, a month or a bit longer and then bail for some other shiny path. 

 

People look at addicts acting out on an addiction and they, I think, find it vulgar and irrational. But everything in that equation from both sides is driven by the exact same thing - the pain. Rich people, poor people, everybody has the pain. All these polished theories or realisations about reality from every corner of the world are pointless, for me. I can get on my knees and pray to God and the pain is still there. 

 

All this business of Nonduality and it's associated concepts, were a security blanket for me. 

 

I figure we're going to be forced to be vegans within a decade and the whole panoply of neurological disorders, psychiatric disorders, physical disorders and auto-immune diseases will be set upon us. 

 

That along with a tipping point in toxic algae blooms, more extreme weather, terrorism, economic and political centralisation, nuclear war or soil depletion probably hitting in my lifetime just makes me see the pain everywhere. So I'm going to die anyway. And if there is life after this and if it matters in a following life, I'd like to mop up as much of the pain in me as possible. 

 

I believe in this because I'm much less paranoid, much less reactive with people and I'm happier. I'm less fucked up. My goal is emotional sobriety. I have to have meaning in this mess. It will suck to live in the society that is coming. 

 

But if I could get to the point where I don't have the pain, that would be wonderful. Love must be there to replace it.

[Phil]

13 hours ago, Agape said:

So what to do about it?

See what is true and what is a belief in accordance with non-conceptual direct experience. 

Inspection is now or not now, as in accordance with direct experience there isn’t a future. 

 

 

Pain is of the body. 

Suffering is of beliefs. 

 

Knowing beliefs are true is arrogance. 

Arrogance is pure suffering.

Suffering is not felt by anyone (else). 

 

 

Knowing beliefs about pain & suffering are true, in spite of emotions felt, in the face of the guidance felt, is hell. 

 

Hell: To cover, conceal, save. One who covers or hides something. 

Arrogance: A manifest feeling of superiority of one's worth or importance, combined with contempt of others. Presumption, pride, haughtiness. Assuming, overbearing, insolent. 

[MetaSage]

53 minutes ago, Phil said:

See what is true and what is a belief in accordance with non-conceptual direct experience. 

Inspection is now or not now, as in accordance with direct experience there isn’t a future. 

 

 

Pain is of the body. 

Suffering is of beliefs. 

 

Knowing beliefs are true is arrogance. 

Arrogance is pure suffering.

Suffering is not felt by anyone (else). 

 

 

Knowing beliefs about pain & suffering are true, in spite of emotions felt, in the face of the guidance felt, is hell. 

 

Hell: To cover, conceal, save. One who covers or hides something. 

Arrogance: A manifest feeling of superiority of one's worth or importance, combined with contempt of others. Presumption, pride, haughtiness. Assuming, overbearing, insolent. 

 

I'd challenge the assumption that pain is of the body. Pain is an activity that you do. If you can grasp its nature, you can stop generating it. Some sensation would be there, but no pain as you wouldn't be creating it.

 

Of course, this is an intellectual endeavor. Contemplating pain would be required.

 

[MetaSage]

@Phil Can't I bookmark your comment above?

[Phil]

1 hour ago, MetaSage said:

 

I'd challenge the assumption that pain is of the body. Pain is an activity that you do. If you can grasp its nature, you can stop generating it. Some sensation would be there, but no pain as you wouldn't be creating it.

 

Of course, this is an intellectual endeavor. Contemplating pain would be required.

 

Of course, feel free to!  🤍

[Phil]

36 minutes ago, MetaSage said:

@Phil Can't I bookmark your comment above?

You can click the + sign and paste comments in a journal. 

[Agape]

@Phil, you can drill down into the epistemological, psychological and semantic analysis of this all you want. But you'll miss the point. You are an emotionally retarded cunt. I will never come back here. Good luck with being a cunt. 

[Phil]

9 minutes ago, Agape said:

@Phil, you can drill down into the epistemological, psychological and semantic analysis of this all you want. But you'll miss the point. You are an emotionally retarded cunt. I will never come back here. Good luck with being a cunt. 

Certainly not meant personally. Wish you the best. ♥️

[Phil]

@Agape

Mentioning this only with respect to open communication, well-being, and the potential for miscommunication… when a discussion on a thread is ‘left’, and private messages and emails are used instead, I don’t read them. I actually use the ‘mute’ feature in email and don’t even see them. I do this because while discordant beliefs coming up & out are very much an aspect of ‘the reality of’ awakening, these beliefs & coresponding emotions don’t have anything to do with anyone else. 

 

It’s like the meme’s about “what you think awakening looks like”, and there’s a picture of a lovely sunset with rainbows and unicorns… compared to “what awakening actually looks like”, and there’s a picture of total disarray, upheaval & madness. 

 

 

There is no intention here whatsoever for this forum to be a facade of conceptualizing, bypassing or denial. 

Expression & emptying, as well as acknowledging emotions is encouraged. 

 

 

That pain is of the body and suffering is of beliefs… is precisely not about epistemological, psychological, intellectualizing or semantic analysis. 

It’s about direct experience & liberation. 

 

Clarity.

Peace, happiness, love essentially. 

 

[Agape]

@Phil, okay. You present as just an objective adjudicator on reality. A benevolent  arbiter on reality. You haven't the faintest clue. I sent you a bunch of e-mails when I was in a place that holds no words. You don't know Hell. You know nothing of demons. Your INTP analysis has, quite factually, done absolutely nothing to alleviate my suffering. You're just another loser teacher who is so arrogant that you think you know 'the truth'. You don't know anything. You created a website like the website you came from and you have no morals. Because you don't have empathy. Act like the slippery fish all you want. But you're so much of a coward.that you had to have Mandy give me a warning instead of you doing it yourself. You're no different from teachers who fuck their own students. You think you aren't duplicitous? You think you're not psychologically in this? Like, to be fair, this is 'your' website and maybe I'm being a prick. But I know I'm a fucking piece of shit. You have a position of privilege. At the very least, which is all.there is, you have a chemical payoff for all this. I don't know. Maybe you think I'm not really real. You've made an enemy out of me. You've crafted and extrapolated a whole ideology from a person who thinks she can speak from some imagined entity. I believed something like that and the doctors told me I have Paranoid Schizophrenia. You don't even have the faintest idea of what that feels like. And I can tell you, from experience, Paranoid Schizophrenia is cake compared to self-hatred. Maybe you'll get Mandy to do it for you, the coward that you are, to give me another warning, so you can funnel out all the non-sychophants, from telling you that nobody can explain how they feel. I will truly sacrifice my own future lives to cast you into the Hell that I feel. You are exactly like every other spiritual teacher and counsellor I have come across. Retarded, has unfortunately been appropriated by the the politically correct brigade. Well then, to expand, I have worked as a support worker for people who have the mental capacity of a 3.year old, and they were, quite truly, much more Enlightening than the rubbish you write. You just want other people to warn people like me away, so that you can insult anyone you want to and not be challenged. I see all you guys. You don't understand. I've seen enough of you guys. You're blind. Yes, you. You all lose yourself to sticking your head in the ground like an ostrich. You learn how to do that. Fuck Nonduality. Fuck Solipsism. Fuck all the conceptual bullshit. You don't see me or anyone. You drop thoughts and think that negates other people's suffering. I knew more understanding from Michael who was 24, couldn't talk and watched the same videos of bananas singing on YouTube all day long. Phil, fuck it, be a complete coward, have somebody else give me a warning again, you truly, taught me nothing. You're just another teacher with confirmation bias. Well, I'm here, right now, to tell you that you looked at someone who is in intense suffering and it felt good for you to smash their head into shit they live in. You know nothing of suffering.