James123 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 On 10/16/2022 at 2:06 AM, nuwu said: content in question: - infinity of gods - mouse-leo - leo's posting style which seems less inclusive to traditional buddhism, reinforcing the observation his views are incompatible Anything that you experience including “you” and “your experience “ is a delusion. Enlightenment is out of charts. It is not knowing, including the word of not knowing. Anything that learned is comes from so called ego. "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuwu Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 to be clear, i'm not arguing against buddhism or leo. both are supported by strong arguments and both make lots of sense. i only scrutinize what i find confusing. personally, i will still explore all spiritual practices. a more loving existence is all we need. in summary, one side says "everything is a state" and another says "everything has a sense of self". i think leo believes states without ego he has been aware of invalidates the latter view, or something, which is why he would lately distance himself from advaita. it doesn't mean he necessarily believes advaita is false, but he might find it incomplete. i have not been aware of such states, nor i have any idea how he actually views spirituality or experiences it. it's mostly intellectual contemplation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 1 hour ago, nuwu said: n summary, one side says "everything is a state" and another says "everything has a sense of self". i think leo believes states without ego he has been aware of invalidates the latter view, or something, which is why he would lately distance himself from advaita. it doesn't mean he necessarily believes advaita is false, but he might find it incomplete. i have not been aware of such states, nor i have any idea how he actually views spirituality or experiences it. it's mostly intellectual contemplation Knowing is the biggest illusion. Language is learned by so called human, it is created. Any so called creation, knowledge and understanding has nothing to do with Truth. Truth is out of chart. Forget everything you know including neo advaita. Whatever left is what the truth is. "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Devin said: o then why's it called truth😜 Just teasing, sort of Lol. Imo it is absolutely true. Or explanation or impilaction of the word of "truth" is more close to it, bu not even lol 😂 43 minutes ago, Devin said: Whatever is left is all you actually know Yep. That's it. But actually there is no you or I there 😂😂😂 Edited October 18, 2022 by James123 "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 10 minutes ago, Devin said: 40 minutes ago, James123 said: 😂😂😂 You sure? I think everything's there. What is everything, you or I? 10 minutes ago, Devin said: That's why I don't like the word truth for it, it implies everything else is false, but in actuality, it's more like the opposite. Now is before birth. Rest is an amazing illusion. "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 8 hours ago, Devin said: Everything that's ever imagined, you, i, infinity These are all illusions, thoughts, learned and experienced. But amazing illusions, heaven.😍😍😍 "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 20 hours ago, Devin said: There is more than just cessation of thought though, that's why I agree with Leo on Buddhism, although his tact is distasteful it may be the most honest and effective way to unBuddha people The word ‘Buddha’ is Sanskrit and means, ‘enlightened one.’ “I agree with someone else about there not being separate selves… although his tact is distasteful it may be the most honest effective way to un-enlightened one people”. You can throw reason and common sense out the window to be in agreement, but you don’t have to. YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 (edited) 20 hours ago, Devin said: There is more There isn't "more" of anything. This is Actualized.org dogma. Actualized has nothing to do with everyday life - nonduality has everything to do with everyday life. Edited October 19, 2022 by Blessed2 There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 It's the "problem" of desire again, when you think you know what you want, you don't really know what you really want. Buddhism doesn't teach that you need to "burn through your karma", it looks back at desire itself and sits with it. If some religion told you that you need to be self sacrificing and only have compassion for others, you might resist because you care for yourself. But what if there is no self and giving up your cares for it, is the only thing you really, really want? What if it only seems like you have to burn through karma or "make it happen" because long ago you cut yourself off and limited yourself from wanting all the things that are possible because in your belief in being a finite separate self you believed that your true desires were not possible? What if what looks unappealing and limiting is actually just a key to unlock a door? Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: seemingly incompatible experiences (non-duality + duality?), Nonduality is not two, nonduality and duality would be two. With duality meaning two, nonduality and duality would actually imply three. Similarly, nonduality and experience would be two, and nonduality and experiences would imply three. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: what does it mean to "do nothing"? Applying meaning would be a doing. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: if one is meditating, isnt she already imagining herself not taking psychedelics? That would be attention on the activity of thought, not meditation per se. The self imagined is illusory. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: why is such delay required, if bodily functions are illusions? Bodily functions are apparent. The delay is illusory. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: so what is the difference between meditation and some ever lasting trips? ‘Ever lasting trips’ is the activity of thought, the ‘ten thousand things’. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: buddha claims ego's attachments are the source of suffering, but why would such attachments matter when they are themselves imaginary? Ego is attachment, not an entity which has or experiences attachment. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: is the only one that is provably actual? were you ever aware of a state where meditation doesn't work? With respect to nonduality what’s actual isn’t provable. Proof & states are the activity of thought. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: shouldnt the absolute be transcendental to states and degree of awareness? ‘It’ is, and can also believe self referential thoughts which ‘it’s’ appearing as, that it isn’t. (States and degrees). But first there must be ego, the illusion of ignorance, the believing one is a separate self; the knower which knows of states and degrees. Aka purporting. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: how do we know what it takes to reach the absolute? “Reaching ‘it’ “ is a misnomer or if you will, misleading. Nonduality is already the case, and the absolute is veiled or obscured only by it’s own activity of thought. Thus meditation is an unveiling, via the allowing of the cessation of the activity of thought, and hence the ‘washing out’ of all beliefs, typically an emotionally laden apparent process. For glimpses there are psychedelics, but I suspect you’re beginning to see the shortcoming of glimpses with respect to spiritual ego or identifying with what is illusory - the separate self which knows states, degrees, levels, etc. On 10/15/2022 at 7:06 PM, nuwu said: if everything is a single self-loving entity, why would rejection of anything be ever necessary to obtain truth? Rejection isn’t necessary. Meditation is not a rejection of thoughts, it’s just deep relaxation and allowing thought to come to rest. Negation can seem to be helpful and is very often mistaken for rejection, while rejection is the denial of thought attachment, and therein mistaken identity, self deception, misinformation, misleadership, manipulation, etc, etc. YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 49 minutes ago, Devin said: But what they teach as the end goal "awakening", which in Buddhism is cessation of thought, should not be the end goal. Realize what is thought, but also realize believing thoughts are bad(need for cessation) is a thought. Thoughts are not bad. This was already explained in this thread and is circular ’thinking’. Infinity isn’t an idea, “it’s” This. Therein is thought attachment, and again a finger pointing to meditation. Not sure where this ‘thought is bad’ comes from. Of course bad is just a thought. YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 14 minutes ago, Devin said: There's more than "nothingness", "truth", "cessation of thought", 😂😂 "There issing" and "more" are thoughts. Focus on whatever else and the whole thing no longer is. There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 2 minutes ago, Devin said: As in nothing else can exist? No As in focus on whatever else. There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loop Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Thought is Feeling disassociated into seeming ‘parts’, the cessation of thought is Freedom, chasing after deeper states, deeper awakening, deeper anything, is the illusion, what is really ‘needed’ is just FEELING deeper into the body, which is what seems to happen when one lets thought activity go, rather then getting caught in its cycle. Let it be there, inspect it, the illusion is the content, the real is the Feel. There isn’t even an ‘end goal’ it is literally just how you naturally are. To me it seems Leo has been rejecting the Body for a long time, coming up with terms like ‘Infinite Mind’ , basically not wanting to settle and feel, so instead just goes on a spiritual journey where one can always find ‘more’ and be ‘better’. ‘Greater then Buddha, greater then Jesus’ good lord, ask yourself, really ask yourself, “Does Love believe or feel it is better then anything or worse then anything?” There isn’t a teaching, the Teacher is Feeling. Ten thousand tears, One Belly Laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 46 minutes ago, Devin said: No, infinity. There's more than "nothingness", "truth", "cessation of thought", "illusion" That was pretty funny. 😂 Thank you for that. 🤍 YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 20 minutes ago, Devin said: Therefore there is always "more". You all are looking at an "end", a concept. This is of the heart of why Actualized felt so off and why I left, and why everyone will eventually leave it behind. There is no "more", nor is there "endgame". These are thoughts, the illusion. Both feel off. Because both convey as if there is world, things, importance, meaning, purpose, value. Nothing, cessation, is the only liberation. This is not to say that nothing/cessation is an "end". It is that there is no end, or more. There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 12 minutes ago, Devin said: So then by that logic ... 13 minutes ago, Devin said: Seriously you all are falling short, you're believing a concept. There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Devin said: come with me, and you'll see, a world full of pure imagination.... Why do I need to come with you when I hear it's all pure imagination anyway? Edited October 19, 2022 by Blessed2 There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James123 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 56 minutes ago, Devin said: come with me, and you'll see, a world full of pure imagination.... Dont need to go anywhere. Just look at the mirror 😂😂😂 "It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed2 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 (edited) @Devin Was more like pointing the ego tripping. 1 hour ago, Devin said: You think you're awake because you know you have it? No, that's a thought as well No, I am not thinking I am awake. This seems like projection. Edited October 19, 2022 by Blessed2 There must be an effortless way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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