Why does unhooking from society physically hurt

[Devin]

I've put space between me and others for room to think, clear my mind, and relax. It physically hurts, I don't know what emotion it is, I would say fear but it doesn't feel like normal fear.

 

I have desires and I know I will attain them but I am being so impatient, I can meditate and calm myself but it comes back when I'm not. It's bearable but I just feel in pain and I feel like it's unnecessary.

 

Why does it physically hurt? Why am I being impatient?

[Phil]

Welcome! 

 

17 hours ago, Devin said:

Why does it physically hurt?

Physical pain is localized in the body and needs no thought. As an example you could trip & break your foot regardless of any arising thoughts, and you could tell a doctor which foot hurts. 

 

Fear, being an emotion, is different in that fear requires the activity of thought and fear is never localized in the body. An example would be that you could feel fear of a future event, and while you could share your thoughts about a future event, you couldn’t actually point to a fear or a future event. 

 

17 hours ago, Devin said:

Why am I being impatient?

Impatience is fundamentally the belief in the materialist’s paradigm. As thoughts arise & are believed about a separate self which is moving through space & time, the discord of believing these thoughts is felt with the truth or actuality of the situation. 

 

When the truth is seen clearly, it is then seen how one attracted the breaking of the foot, how one creates the emotion of fear, and why the belief in space between me & others feels discordant. 

[Devin]

2 hours ago, Phil said:

Welcome! 

 

Physical pain is localized in the body and needs no thought. As an example you could trip & break your foot regardless of any arising thoughts, and you could tell a doctor which foot hurts. 

 

Fear, being an emotion, is different in that fear requires the activity of thought and fear is never localized in the body. An example would be that you could feel fear of a future event, and while you could share your thoughts about a future event, you couldn’t actually point to a fear or a future event. 

 

Impatience is fundamentally the belief in the materialist’s paradigm. As thoughts arise & are believed about a separate self which is moving through space & time, the discord of believing these thoughts is felt with the truth or actuality of the situation. 

 

When the truth is seen clearly, it is then seen how one attracted the breaking of the foot, how one creates the emotion of fear, and why the belief in space and space between me & others feels discordant. 

I think I understand I bring it on myself, I know I don't need to do anything, but I want to do something, I feel like I should be able to do it without whatever this is (anxiety?), the physical pain, I feel like I should be able to do the task without the pain since I know I don't need to do it. I know I'm missing something that's why I'm asking.

 

I must not truly know I don't need to do it? I must still be "hooked" by "society"/ego/separate self? It must not just be a "want", I must be feeling I need to do it?

Edited September 10, 2022 by Devin

[Phil]

@Devin

That suffering is physical pain and that you could bring it on yourself is what society believes.  That’s what you’re unhooking from. 

[Devin]

@Phil Alright, so just feel it and accept it and know I don't control it, I think that feels better. I attracted it but I'm not in control of it

[Phil]

@Devin

More so creating it than attracting it.  What does impatience tell you about what you’re thinking? Maybe feeling great is contingent on desires being met in a future where feeling is, or that feeling must come from others…?

[Devin]

@Phil yes, exactly. The confusing point for me is I can turn it off in usually less than 5 minutes thinking about it, I just don't see why I can't keep that feeling turned off and go about doing what I'm wanting to do. I suppose practice and it will be less and less.

 

I'm doing a big long term project for me right now and at about 75% completion, I haven't been pushing myself this hard in a while. I thought I had this stuff under control better😂

[Phil]

@Devin

Feeling is nondual, on and off don’t apply. 

 

When you push yourself, are you the self pushing or the self being pushed? 
 

When impatience is felt, are you the one who’s impatient or the one who’s feeling impatience? 
 

Maybe the project is 75% happened vs 75% done. 
 

[Devin]

@Phil I'm being pushed, being impatient, 75% happened; I think🤔

[Devin]

Okay I just read something on Mandy's website that helped me clarify for myself what I'm asking

 

 "Like Nisargadatta says, stay with "I am". Like Jesus, says, seek first the kingdom of heaven. Like Louise Hay says, approve of yourself, like Abraham Hicks says, get in the Vortex and then."

 

I'm struggling to stay in that state. I feel like what I'm doing is what I consciously want to do though, I don't feel like I'm doing it out of fear or ego but I'm falling into impatience. So I must be doing it out of fear right? Or at least falling into fear?

 

I've been having people around me being negative, I think that's leaching into my thinking.

 

I guess I need a break and re-center

Edited September 11, 2022 by Devin

[Phil]

4 hours ago, Devin said:

"Like Nisargadatta says, stay with "I am". Like Jesus, says, seek first the kingdom of heaven. Like Louise Hay says, approve of yourself, like Abraham Hicks says, get in the Vortex and then."

These are pointings to feeling & presence, to truth, to yourself, via non-aversion, non-conceptualization. 

4 hours ago, Devin said:

I'm struggling to stay in that state. I feel like what I'm doing is what I consciously want to do though, I don't feel like I'm doing it out of fear or ego but I'm falling into impatience. So I must be doing it out of fear right? Or at least falling into fear?

 

I've been having people around me being negative, I think that's leaching into my thinking.

 

I guess I need a break and re-center

These are innocent egocentric conceptualizations, or, mental aversion from feeling. Without conceptualizing there would be no impatience because there would be no states to chase, no belief in a separate self in states, or in others who are leaching, negative, or the cause of ‘your’ impatience. Without believing these concepts, there would then be no belief in a need, as it relates to how you feel. 

 

As far as fear if it’s related it’s only in so far as an unwillingness to feel jealousy, which could be to hold a mental facade of superiority, but is likely just conjecture.

[Devin]

@Phil ooh, thank you. I've got to think about that a bit, I think it's on the nose though. Definitely repressing jealousy, thanks

Edited September 12, 2022 by Devin

[Devin]

@Phil Okay that really helped, thank you.

 

This is all bullshit, and doesn't matter, just feel; that choice immediately gets me to joy. Doing what I want to do doesn't really matter, I'll still do it just for fun but it's just a made up idea and actually doesn't get me anything or anywhere, I have all I ever "need" or can "have".

 

So, I've been able to get to this point and stay here in the past but I've been falling out of it with the project I'm doing, I suppose it just takes practice and the more you do it the less you have to "re-center" yourself? Or do you think im missing something else as well? It get's replaced in my mind with "concepts" when im not thinking about it.

 

Do you think you can think about both? Keep this in your mind while also doing tasks? It seems to get covered up easily for me, focus on feeling while also focussing on doing things. I think I feel like just feeling and see where it takes me but I think I won't do much. Must be another concept I have making me think I should do stuff

Edited September 12, 2022 by Devin

[Phil]

4 hours ago, Devin said:

 

This is all bullshit, and doesn't matter, just feel; that choice immediately gets me to joy. Doing what I want to do doesn't really matter, I'll still do it just for fun but it's just a made up idea and actually doesn't get me anything or anywhere, I have all I ever "need" or can "have".

There might be a tiny unsuspected remnant of states lingering in the psyche. Maybe the outright thought ‘states’ is dispelled, but the framing or thinking in terms of states is yet to be seen. Therein, joy might be framed as a state, as in ‘get’s me to joy’. But isn’t it so, that ‘this is all bullshit and doesn’t matter; just feel’ is not a getting to, but is a clearing away? Isn’t the this of ‘this is all bullshit’ basically… thoughts? Specifically discordant thoughts and maybe even thoughts about getting to, a state (joy). If so, direct experience would dictate that there isn’t per se a me that gets to a joy, but a joy which clears away some thoughts. I imagine someone pulling off the road and asking for directions to joy. 

 

4 hours ago, Devin said:

So, I've been able to get to this point and stay here in the past but I've been falling out of it with the project I'm doing, I suppose it just takes practice and the more you do it the less you have to "re-center" yourself? Or do you think im missing something else as well? It get's replaced in my mind with "concepts" when im not thinking about it.

Similarly, ‘the past’ might be a fill in or replacement thought for state. Now it will probably be read humorously… ‘I’ve been able to get to this point and stay here in the past’. How could one stay here… in the past? Maybe joy is synonymous with here, or now, or presence, or present, and thoughts seem to weave up ‘a past’ and or ‘states’, an I was in? Now I’m imagining joy saying ‘uh, ya… go head bruh I’ll definitely be right here when ‘you get back’. 

 

4 hours ago, Devin said:

Do you think you can think about both? Keep this in your mind while also doing tasks? It seems to get covered up easily for me, focus on feeling while also focussing on doing things. I think I feel like just feeling and see where it takes me but I think I won't do much. Must be another concept I have making me think I should do stuff

With states as an object such as a thing to get to in a future or a thing experienced in a past dispelled, that leaves the indirect residue of states, the subject, who was said to be or not be in, states. ‘It’ (joy, the object / state sought) seems to get covered up easily for me (the subject / seeker of the object as a state sought). 

 

The alleged subject enters the scene as the thinker, doer, focuser and one who has a mind. If you said ‘watermelon’ and I said where is the watermelon, you could point to something. But thinker, doer, focuser and one with a mind are more like unicorn. If I said where is the unicorn, there would just be a peaceful blankness, ‘followed’ surely yet again by unobscured  joy. 

 

 

 

[Devin]

@Phil definitely a clearing away, and states still in the psyche,

 

All thoughts are bullshit, Joy is always right here. 

 

Thank you