Mandy Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 10 hours ago, spiritual dreams said: @Mandy insightful How is writing the same thoughts out insightful whereas the intrusive thoughts feel horrible? Quote Mention Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 7 hours ago, Phil said: It’s like holding a ball. The contraction, the effort, is the holding. The letting go is the releasing of. The challenge is holding. The challenge is honest expression, isn’t it so? About the specific one….? I get what you mean, but there is a certain fear preventing me from doing that. Like if I let go, I will actually manifest the intrusive thoughts. 7 hours ago, Phil said: But how does the belief about there being parts of your mind and and a they asserting in your mind feel, in comparison to being honest? Well there are pros and cons to it. Thinking of the mind as parts is useful as it allows you to apply systems thinking to the mind. This allows for really deep trauma healing that otherwise wasn't available with the perspective of one mind. It also seems to me the most accurate in my day to day life. For example, there is a part of me that wants to be motivated and productive, while another part of me wants to procrastinate. I can literally feel them in different places in my energetic body as well as their energetic pull. 8 hours ago, Phil said: Do you care more about being right or how you feel? Since caring is based on feelings, I care more about how I feel. Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 @Mandy That is an interesting question. When it's in my head, it feels more real and there's a lot of resistance, whereas when I write it down, its just words. Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 27 minutes ago, spiritual dreams said: I get what you mean, but there is a certain fear preventing me from doing that. Like if I let go, I will actually manifest the intrusive thoughts. Well there are pros and cons to it. Thinking of the mind as parts is useful as it allows you to apply systems thinking to the mind. This allows for really deep trauma healing that otherwise wasn't available with the perspective of one mind. It also seems to me the most accurate in my day to day life. For example, there is a part of me that wants to be motivated and productive, while another part of me wants to procrastinate. I can literally feel them in different places in my energetic body as well as their energetic pull. Since caring is based on feelings, I care more about how I feel. Sure. Now express jealousy. Just empty both barrels. Aim em at Phil if it’s helpful. Doesn’t matter. If it’s useful, this body is overflowing with bliss, as there are no self referential thoughts arising, and therein no experience of fear. What‘s desired is manifesting perfectly. Relationship - perfection. Parenting - perfection. Communion - perfection. Friendships - perfection. Hobbies, interests - perfection. What’s next - perfection. Absolutely hopeless. Islam - perfection. Christianity - perfection. Fear - perfection. (Stop me anytime). Your parents - perfection. Synchronicity, that this comes on - perfection. First, second, third world countries - perfection. Apparent spontaneity - FLAWLESS perfection. Freedom - perfection. No thing to surrender, no one to surrender no thing - Per. Fec. Tion. You can’t meditate - 😲 - Perfection. You’re convinced there is ‘consciousness work’ and it’s ‘serious’ - perfection. Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 @Phil its hard to think of death, murder, torture and genocide as perfection and those happen to my the subjects of my intrusive thoughts. Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 @spiritual dreams Sure. What’s the jealousy about? Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Jealousy is felt - perfection. Hatred’s next - 🙊- perfection. You’re stuck - perfection. You can’t - perfection. You don’t want to feel, you want to be right - per.fec.tion. You want control - even of other people - perfection. You’re not enough - perfection. Held these beliefs for too long - 🎤- perfection. Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 4 minutes ago, Phil said: @spiritual dreams Sure. What’s the jealousy about? huh? I don't really feel jealousy. Its more about death, torture rape, murder and genocide. Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 34 minutes ago, spiritual dreams said: huh? I don't really feel jealousy. Its more about death, torture rape, murder and genocide. Sure. There is no experience whatsoever of any of those thoughts here. There is no denial whatsoever. There’s a world filled with people actually doing something about those issues. Focusing on wanted with zero resistance, filled to the brim, everyday, with spirit, inspiration. Perfection. There’s cowards, too. People that just ruminate and complain about the same nonsense for decades wasting their life. Perfection! Pull a rubber band back, let it go, it’s flies. Perfection. Presence - perfection. Wanting to feel empowered - perfection. Denial emotion is felt, believing what isn’t in direct experience is felt - perfection. Believing you need to gain something to feel better - perfection. Believing that some thing is understanding when there is no experience of understanding - perfection. Believing some one knows there is no actual experience of understanding - perfection. Christianity, witches & guillotines - perfection. Believing you’re breathing & thinking right now - perfection. Death - perfection. Torture - perfection. Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Rape - perfection. Genocide - perfection. These actions need a doer. Raised Christian here, was very devout about it, took it extremely seriously, and the compulsion to promising my soul to the devil was the most intrusive, worst feeling thought I ever had. The Devil - perfection. S/He's the ultimate one "doing it, all those heinous things", the ultimate scapegoat. You are the Devil. Hiding yourself in actions. Like red absorbs all wavelengths of color and rejects only red, it appears red. This is how identification "works". Look beyond the appearance, and know thyself as the angel of light, or rather the light. Quote Mention Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Murder - perfection. Pain - perfection. Misery - perfection. Evil - perfection. Disgust - perfection. Suffering - perfection. Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 2 hours ago, Mandy said: Rape - perfection. Genocide - perfection. 1 hour ago, Phil said: Misery - perfection. Evil - perfection. Disgust - perfection. Suffering - perfection. How can these things be perfection? From a nondual point of view I can kind of see it. But from the human perspective, these things really suck. Like would you really think it would be perfection is someone raped , tortured and killed your children? Or if you and everyone you knew was put in a concentration camp and exterminated? Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 @spiritual dreams I think, "if ______________ happened that would be awful." That thought occuring now is a microcosm of the suffering. All of the suffering is inherent in that one though now. It's not "out there". Quote Mention Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said: How can these things be perfection? That there are things which are perfection would be along the lines of panpsychism or subjective experience. That it seems like there are things is perfection. 1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said: From a nondual point of view I can kind of see it. But from the human perspective, these things really suck. Totally. But human perspective is the thought human perspective. 1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said: Like would you really think it would be perfection is someone raped , tortured and killed your children? Or if you and everyone you knew was put in a concentration camp and exterminated? Perfection isn’t thinkable. Thinker is the thought thinker. There’s only one source and it is Good. Literal infinite Goodness. There’s just no way of getting around that. Why try really. Discord doesn’t really create anything wanted. Why pay such attention to such unwanted? Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 9, 2023 Author Share Posted April 9, 2023 @Phil @Mandy Fair enough. But could I be manifesting these things through thought and resistance? Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 1 hour ago, spiritual dreams said: @Phil @Mandy Fair enough. But could I be manifesting these things through thought and resistance? That thought comes from fear and worry, what it manifests is more suffering with believing the idea that you must control your thoughts. You don't control your thoughts, you just watch em'. Like the difference you noted earlier between writing the intrusive thoughts like you did earlier in the thread and thinking them. Quote Mention Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 10, 2023 Author Share Posted April 10, 2023 @Mandy Oh ok that kind of makes sense. How does manifestation happen then if not through thoughts? Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 3 hours ago, spiritual dreams said: @Phil @Mandy Fair enough. But could I be manifesting these things through thought and resistance? Are you experiencing these things, or focusing on thoughts about these things? If you are not actually experiencing what the thoughts are about, then no, clearly you are not manifesting these things. Quote Mention YouTube Website Sessions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritual dreams Posted April 10, 2023 Author Share Posted April 10, 2023 @Phil ok makes sense. thanks Quote Mention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 9 hours ago, spiritual dreams said: @Mandy Oh ok that kind of makes sense. How does manifestation happen then if not through thoughts? You can't attract anything bad. You can attract something rapidly clarifying. Attraction is realization = recognition. I want to see a yellow car, I put the desire and intention out there and I feel satisfaction when I see a yellow car, rather than not even noticing when I drive past the yellow car. It's all about awareness where I am. You realize your dreams by recognizing them. You put in your order with the waiter of the restaurant, with the Genie, you don't mumble to the waiter "I don't want the chicken alfredo", he might bring you nothing or he might bring you the chicken alfredo because you didn't clearly speak what you did want, and you recognize then that what you want it to clearly place your order, to clearly focus on what you do want. You cannot attract in anyone else's experience. You cannot attract anything bad for another. No worries about that. Quote Mention Youtube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.