What's wrong about Nihilism?

[Devin]

        Most people only know the caricature of Nihilism that "nothing matters", but that's a gross undercharacterization, Nihilists didn't believe you should just do whatever morally outrageous thing in the moment with no regard for consequences, they were realists and pragmatists, they just didn't believe in doing something for pure 'ethic' or religious reasoning. I don't think the Nihilists had everything figured out but with Advaita and Nihilism I say the combination is the truth.

     

    What's wrong about Nihilism?

 

nihilism, (from Latin nihil, “nothing”), originally a philosophy of moral and epistemological skepticism that arose in 19th-century Russia during the early years of the reign of Tsar Alexander II. The term was famously used by Friedrich Nietzsche to describe the disintegration of traditional morality in Western society. In the 20th century, nihilism encompassed a variety of philosophical and aesthetic stances that, in one sense or another, denied the existence of genuine moral truths or values, rejected the possibility of knowledge or communication, and asserted the ultimate meaninglessness or purposelessness of life or of the universe.

 

@Someone here any thoughts young Socrates?

Everyone else too.

Edited March 29 by Devin

[Someone here]

There are many different types of nihilists. The most common ones from what I can tell are existential nihilist.. who deny that there is an inherent meaning in life.. and moral nihilist.. who deny that there is an inherent morality. These types of people claim that such concepts are not universal and far from objective. In the realization that these concepts do not exist in reality.. the only sensible way I can see to get through these problems is to create your own morality or meaning in life. 

[Devin]

        My meaning is to enjoy, not just the instagram type of enjoyment, but even enjoying personal disasters and pain and suffering, enjoying my own sadness and depression and anxiety even. Of course also enjoying the sunset, human communion, and surfing etc., also enjoying nothingness and oneness.

[Someone here]

6 minutes ago, Devin said:

My meaning is to enjoy

You've got the point of life figured out 🙂

[Joseph Maynor]

It’s  not a particularly good philosophy in my opinion if you want to develop a mature social perspective.  I think the chest beating regarding truth is similarly averse to a mature social

perspective as well.  Those are two extremes that can limit people’s ability to collaborate with others and to keep an open mind imo.

 

 

[spiritual dreams]

Usually nihilists aren't fully nihilist since they believe that nothing having meaning is bad.

True nihilism would understand that good and bad don't even exist.

 

[Joseph Maynor]

15 minutes ago, spiritual dreams said:

Usually nihilists aren't fully nihilist since they believe that nothing having meaning is bad.

True nihilism would understand that good and bad don't even exist.

 

Ditto for true and false.  Nietzsche was a nihilist in this sense.  I think it's ok to go through a nihilist stage or phase on the path but personally I don't think it's a viable end state.
 

 

Edited March 29 by Joseph Maynor

[spiritual dreams]

@Joseph Maynor I think full blown nihilism taken to its end point would end up at nonduality, but the problem is the ego would resist.

[Devin]

54 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

It’s  not a particularly good philosophy in my opinion if you want to develop a mature social perspective.  I think the chest beating regarding truth is similarly averse to a mature social

perspective as well.  Those are two extremes that can limit people’s ability to collaborate with others and to keep an open mind imo.

 

 

        I don't think what you're describing is actual Nihilism though, just a hijacked pseudo Nihilism that I usually see, most people don't actually know what Nihilism is. Nihilism is just realism, no idealism, as in without the idea of traditional Christian or religious moral guilt. It's not believing you can commit atrocities and be fine, those things have real consequences.

 

         Nietzche’s views were really just that rules and morals are just social constructs, there's no supreme Morals from a Deity or  metaphysical Karma.

 

 

Edited March 29 by Devin

[Jonas Long]

Nothings wrong with nihilism, it's not even a thing. 

[Devin]

3 minutes ago, Jonas Long said:

Nothings wrong with nihilism, it's not even a thing. 

So nothing matters? It doesn't matter what anyone does? Hitler killing Jews?

[Jonas Long]

3 minutes ago, Devin said:

So nothing matters? It doesn't matter what anyone does? Hitler killing Jews?

The holocaust wasn't nihilism, it was highly motivated evil.  And, as I said, nihilism isn't even a thing. 

[Devin]

Just now, Jonas Long said:

The holocaust wasn't nihilism, it was highly motivated evil.  And, as I said, nihilism isn't even a thing. 

Nihilism says there's nothing wrong with the holocaust or genocide.

[Jonas Long]

2 minutes ago, Devin said:

Nihilism says there's nothing wrong with the holocaust or genocide.

Also nothing right or even "ok" about it though.  Anyway, you can relax, because there are no actual nihilists. 

[Devin]

1 minute ago, Jonas Long said:

Also nothing right or even "ok" about it though.  Anyway, you can relax, because there are no actual nihilists. 

But there's nothing wrong with mass murder? (Nothing wrong with Nihilism)

[Someone here]

@Devin

Ideas like good and evil.. right and wrong.. value.. meaning.. worth etc. are often treated as objective ideas but if you were to observe nature that's divorced from human society.. none of those qualities are intrinsic to it. Such ideas are ultimately born from the human consciousness.. and thus dependent on it. Thus they are reliant entirely on the mind that thinks them. making them subjective. And hold zero value objectively. 

The mindset of a nihilist.. at least in my experience.. is one of progression. They can see what (they perceive) is true and false.. and they abandon the falsities and move forward in the knowledge of the truth. Many existential nihilists abandon what society or some other organization objectifies as "meaningful" or "successful" and makes of it what they will. To some nihilists.. All that matters is the quality of the present moment.. Cuz that's all there is. So often they are open to hedonism.. Chasing what gives them immediate pleasure might be a preferable way of doing life since it's all a big meaningless vanity in the end. 

 

[Jonas Long]

4 minutes ago, Devin said:

But there's nothing wrong with mass murder? (Nothing wrong with Nihilism)

Calm down my boy and read the words I'm writing instead of getting triggered and putting words in my mouth.  There is no such thing as nihilism. 

[Mandy]

There's nothing wrong with it, but pessimism colors lots of thoughts in strange ways. If you believe your perception is crystal clear, instead of listening to the guidance of the pessimism, you might just become very popular with people who also experience lots of pessimism. 🤷‍♂️

[Joseph Maynor]

1 hour ago, Devin said:

        I don't think what you're describing is actual Nihilism though, just a hijacked pseudo Nihilism that I usually see, most people don't actually know what Nihilism is. Nihilism is just realism, no idealism, as in without the idea of traditional Christian or religious moral guilt. It's not believing you can commit atrocities and be fine, those things have real consequences.

 

         Nietzche’s views were really just that rules and morals are just social constructs, there's no supreme Morals from a Deity or  metaphysical Karma.

 

 

 

You make a good point.  There are different versions of nihilism.  Here's a few more good videos:
 

 

Edited March 30 by Joseph Maynor

[Devin]

17 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Devin

Ideas like good and evil.. right and wrong.. value.. meaning.. worth etc. are often treated as objective ideas but if you were to observe nature that's divorced from human society.. none of those qualities are intrinsic to it. Such ideas are ultimately born from the human consciousness.. and thus dependent on it. Thus they are reliant entirely on the mind that thinks them. making them subjective. And hold zero value objectively. 

The mindset of a nihilist.. at least in my experience.. is one of progression. They can see what (they perceive) is true and false.. and they abandon the falsities and move forward in the knowledge of the truth. Many existential nihilists abandon what society or some other organization objectifies as "meaningful" or "successful" and makes of it what they will. To some nihilists.. All that matters is the quality of the present moment.. Cuz that's all there is. So often they are open to hedonism.. Chasing what gives them immediate pleasure might be a preferable way of doing life since it's all a big meaningless vanity in the end. 

 

 

       Well hedonism is a bit short sighted though(on the supposed Nihilist's part), Nietzsche for example was a composer and poet, not a drunk or womanizer.

 

 

Edited March 29 by Devin